955: Strategies from Wall Street to Latin America to grow YOUR business with global talent w/ Aaron Segal

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Hey, what is up?

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Welcome to this episode of the Entrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.

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As always, I'm your host, brian Lofermento, and I'm so excited for all the things that we're gonna learn from today's guest.

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This is not only an incredible entrepreneur, but this is someone who I would argue his entire life is focused on growth Growth in his professional career, growth in the financial sector and now growth in ways that is really unlocking a whole new stream of talent for entrepreneurs and businesses at all sizes in all different industries.

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Let me tell you all about today's guest.

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His name is Aaron Segal.

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Aaron has 20 years of experience on Wall Street in the hedge fund industry.

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He helped his firm successfully navigate the great financial crisis From 2013 to 2019, he helped scale a corporate debt and equity hedge fund from $150 million to over $3 billion.

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He also launched and grew a fund from $50 million to over $200 million between 2019 and 2023, which I love the fact that he's taken all of this experience and all of these insights into business and what makes growth happen and he co-founded his company, ivy League, to help small businesses grow and to bring to life the idea that global remote talent is going to be the biggest trend in the labor market this decade, outside of AI.

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To tell you a little bit about his company.

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I am a big believer in this because everyone wants to talk about AI, but global teams are where it's at.

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There's a world of talent out there and we've never been more connected to them when it comes to our own efforts to grow our businesses.

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So Ivy League is a premier white glove headhunter agency with a simple mission to deliver top overseas talent in Latin America for US companies at a significant discount to domestic candidates, but with the same or I'm going to argue, better quality of work, skills and loyalty, as behind the scenes, a lot of you know that our team is comprised of international talent, with Laura our lead producer, and she manages so much behind the scenes.

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She's based in Colombia and what Aaron's doing with his company really shows the power in all of these benefits.

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They help entrepreneurs and small businesses scale and delegate by providing talent at 50 to 80% lower costs, so that visionaries can build all star teams without going broke in the process.

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If you're ready to grow, then we are all going to learn so much from today's guests.

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So let's dive straight into my interview with Aaron Segal.

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All right, aaron, I'm so excited that you're here with us today.

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First things first, welcome to the show.

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Thank you so much, Brian.

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That was such a wonderful introduction.

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I hope I can live up to the kind words that you just spoke on my behalf.

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Heck, yeah, I'm sure you're going to, because I am definitely biased in this regard.

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It's something that we behind the scenes preach and practice so much, and I love the fact that you bring it to the marketplace.

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But before we get there, aaron, take us beyond the bio.

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You had such an incredibly accomplished career.

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You and I talked off air about the golden handcuffs that you experienced.

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So take us beyond the bio.

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Who's Aaron?

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How'd you start doing all these amazing things?

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Yeah, well, so I have been like, like you mentioned, I was in the hedge fund industry and finance and Wall Street up in New York for nearly 20 years.

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I, in you know, my studies kind of focused on economics and I always excelled with with economics, especially macroeconomics, where study of kind of the whole system and trying to piece together various interplays and patterns.

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And I love the game of trying to piece a puzzle together on the biggest stage ever.

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That would allow you to connect globally with lots of different people and lots of different ideas and themes that were happening simultaneously across the world.

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And so that drew me to that world, you know, and here I was a young, 22 year old kid and didn't really even know what a hedge fund was and uh, but just knew I wanted to be a trader and a wall street guy.

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And you know, it's just very funny how, how we often pick our careers before we've really figured out who we are.

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But that's maybe getting a little too philosophical early in this conversation.

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But one thing led to another and I ended up kind of in that world and I was working in that business for a couple of years, and then, of course, the great financial crisis came about, and that was an amazing opportunity for me.

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You know, I think in any business or any career, if you can, very early on, cut your teeth in a trying period of time, that is the best mentor.

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You know, truthfully, I never had a lot of amazing mentors in my career.

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You know, from a from a you know, individual perspective, there's a lot of competition in my industry and so people are a little more guarded, and I know some people had amazing mentors in my industry.

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So I don't want to necessarily over extrapolate, but for me, the biggest mentor was experience, was experience in trying times, and so I took it upon myself during that period of time to understand what was going on in a certain pocket of the market, which were credit derivatives, which was really what was the cause of that crisis, and no one at my firm really had any expertise there, and I was just kind of this young kid and took it upon myself to find that niche, built that niche, and that kind of led me into my next job, which was to build a startup hedge fund in 2013.

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And from there, like you mentioned in the intro, we launched with about 150 million in assets and we helped build that to a peak of around 3 billion and we decided to shut that down in 2019.

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Everyone was kind of just burnt out and had some different ideas about where they wanted to go, and so we kind of amicably all parted ways with the whole team it was about 20 of us and then one of my other colleagues from the same firm.

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He approached me about starting another hedge fund and, honestly, back then I was already starting to explore the entrepreneurial path.

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I was really into health and wellness.

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I was exploring a couple of different ideas there.

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But you mentioned the golden handcuffs and, as most of the listeners here can probably relate to, entrepreneurialism is hard, you know, and it's a different type of risk.

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You know, I was used to taking risk every day in the market and I had risk with my own finances and I had risk, of course, on behalf of my clients, and that I took very seriously.

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But to take risk as an entrepreneur is a whole different level of uncertainty, and so those golden handcuffs were very tricky for me to extrapolate myself from for a number of years.

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But so I did end up joining him in that hedge fund and it was a great experience.

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We built that for the next three or four years Again started that hedge fund right before COVID.

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So COVID was a great experience for us to learn and adapt to the new market environment and we actually did quite well navigating that.

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But the industry has just changed so much and in a way that I wasn't enjoying it as much.

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It was becoming much more automated, much more algorithmic and on top of that I'd done it for almost 20 years and I was ready for a new challenge and I think that entrepreneurial call just kept kept ringing in my ear throughout that whole time and so last year I decided to kind of call quits and my family and I we had moved down to Miami from New York and that had kind of helped me escape the echo chamber of New York.

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You know, sometimes if you're in a certain industry, you know there's an echo chamber where you think the world only exists around, that.

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You know the Silicon Valley echo chamber, there's probably the Austin echo chamber and there's certainly the New York echo chamber.

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So getting away from that allowed me time to start networking and meeting new people and learning about different opportunities, which of course ended up leading me to, I believe, the global talent.

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Yeah, I love that overview, Aaron.

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There's so much that we're going to go deeper into here in today's conversation.

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But one thing that really stands out in that overview that you gave is you pointed out and correctly so that we happen to choose a career.

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Heck, it even goes back before that we choose our majors before we have any idea who we are and what we want to do on this planet.

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I want to talk about that because obviously you did go into a career that you were very successful at and you gained so many skills along the way.

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We're going to talk about how those skills have transferred, but what I'm most interested in is obviously Ivy League.

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Global talent is something that's doing a lot of good to help other businesses grow.

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That was a very intentional move on your part after a successful career.

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So that's where you recognize not only who you are but the type of impact that you want to have on the world.

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Talk to us about the building blocks behind Ivy League, because you clearly saw opportunity and you clearly see a chance to help other businesses.

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How'd that come about?

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Yeah, so yeah, first of all, to address that first point about picking one's career before we're really prepared for it.

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You know, I think that's unfortunately that's just the way our system is set up, that's the way our educational system is set up and our universities, I believe, don't do an amazing job preparing people to ask that difficult question.

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I'll give an example.

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My wife is from Israel and Israel.

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I love the way they do things, which is that you have to, obviously for different reasons, you have to serve in the military, but then, after the military, you tend to take a year sabbatical and travel around the world.

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You don't have to, but that's what a lot of young Israelis do.

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And then they go study at university.

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For me, I felt like the average American goes to university at their 18 before they're emotionally and mentally developed enough to start asking those deep questions.

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But such is life and sometimes you need to go down that journey.

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That's, that's just part of the.

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The journey of life is to experiment, explore to, to discover what you like, to discover what you don't like, and for me, that journey was, was great.

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There was a lot, like I mentioned before.

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There was a lot of things I loved about it.

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But what drew me to Ivy League was basically a mix of my personal aspirations with a sprinkle of what I had already learned in my career on Wall Street.

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On Wall Street, I was always looking at trends.

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I was always trying to uncover what kind of the next big trend is.

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I always also was very interested in demographics in the labor market.

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In my work I did a lot of kind of macro strategic analysis, especially when COVID hit, we were starting to really study the labor markets, and so one of the things that really appealed to me about Ivy League was, frankly, it was not my idea, it was my brother-in-law's idea, who's my business partner, and he had done the kind of four-hour work, week tim ferris strategy of building businesses for a decade.

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Um, his name is ari um and he is an amazing entrepreneur.

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He's a serial entrepreneur, so he in some ways probably is the better person to be on the show than I am.

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But he he had built all these businesses through hiring talent offshore, mostly in Latin America, and I had the privilege of meeting some of his team and some of the employees over the years and I was just always so impressed entrepreneurs, founders, business people about just how impeccably he had kind of crafted these businesses and in a very efficient, cost-effective way.

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All of his businesses that he built were self-funded and in order to do that, you need to find very creative ways of doing that.

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But, more importantly, I think most people think of offshore talent or hiring offshore or nearshoring, whatever you want to call it remotely, even before COVID, because COVID kind of changed everything.

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We can get to that, but even before then it was, you know, fiverr or you know you would.

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Basically, it was very project oriented and the problem with that.

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That certainly serves a purpose and that's amazing and it serves a purpose on.

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That's amazing and it serves a purpose on both sides.

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Um, it's kind of like the uber of the labor market, uh, in terms of matchmaking, matchmaking platforms.

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But for businesses who want to build at scale and who want to start actually delegating to trusted teams and to create something with longevity and duration, that doesn't really solve that problem.

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And if you're trying to grow or you're trying to delegate, you're going to need something more.

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And there were two issues that were starting to arise here in the US that were making it harder, which was, of course, with labor costs were going up dramatically and there was fewer and fewer skilled talent in a lot of different fields.

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A lot of people were getting pulled into different occupations, so everybody's chasing software and engineering, and that left a dearth of talent available in other fields like marketing and sales.

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They're also frankly I may ruffle a couple of feathers with this comment, but in in some of the younger generations, especially after COVID, there was a little bit of a of a lack of, of a solid work ethic.

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And also I, I personally believe our education system has suffered quite a bit in the last two decades, and the reason I bring that up is because in Latin America the opposite has been happening.

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Latin America has suffered from massive inequality for decades nearly a century but in the last 20 years the untold story there is that actually a lot of these governments, even some of the more socialist, even some of the more authoritarian governments in Latin America, have actually spent a lot of money devoted to their educational system.

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So higher education has actually seen quite a renaissance in many countries.

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We focus in Mexico, argentina, colombia, but even in countries like Venezuela, which is really suffering Argentina, colombia, but even in countries like Venezuela, which is really suffering, there's actually quite a lot of amazing talent Argentina is also dealing with their kind of currency, an ongoing rolling currency crisis that's really been occurring for them for many years as well.

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So that part of the world has always been near and dear to me.

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I've spent a lot of time down there over the years.

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I used to study martial arts down in Brazil and spent a lot of time there and I really always felt that there was such amazing talent down there.

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And mixing that with the trends I was seeing through my experience in Wall Street and what I was seeing through my brother-in-law, it all kind of coalesced and clicked into this idea of wow, there's something here.

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There's something here to build this in a boutique way that we can do that we will have fun with, because it allows us opportunity to talk with clients and help clients such as other small businesses, entrepreneurs, medium-sized businesses as well.

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We're talking to some clients who are larger of like 200 plus employees or 500 plus employees, who, believe it or not, this is still very new to them.

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So the opportunity to kind of teach anyone from a one person team all the way up to a 200 person team, ways in which they can expand and explore and hire amazing talent in Latin America has been an amazing process so far.

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I mean, it's still pretty new, to be honest with you, we've only been doing this for six months, but it's been an amazing experience so far.

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I mean, it's still pretty new, to be honest with you, we've only been doing this for six months, but it's been an amazing experience so far.

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Yeah, aaron, so much to dig into there, but I'm just going to jump straight into what I imagine is the more controversial side of this world, which I hear when I talk to people about the way that I grow my teams behind the scenes at all of my different businesses, which is a lot of people might be thinking.

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Well, aaron, if you feel like American talent is more expensive and less skilled than ever before, potentially, and overseas talent is more skilled, more loyal, more hardworking and less expensive, then what does that say about the more macro trends in our country?

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Obviously, 80% of our listeners, just like you and I, are here in the United States, and that's a's a concerning trend.

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So I want to ask you this because, as someone who comes from the financial markets, it seems to me like in the financial markets, you guys are obsessed with looking at the future and already pricing it in.

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That's one thing that, when I studied economics and finance, professors were always like if a company announces expected earnings that meet their targets, what happens to the stock price?

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Nothing, because it was already priced in.

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You already knew that that's what was going to be.

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Company announces expected earnings that meet their targets, what happens to the stock price?

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Nothing, because it was already priced in.

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You already knew that that's what was going to be the case.

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What do you see for those macro trends in the US?

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And I'm going to ask you this in a two-faceted way, because we're having two concurrent conversations, which is one about the labor market, but two you're one of us, you're a fellow entrepreneur.

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I firmly believe that, as the labor markets continue to trend, it only further incentivizes us to get into entrepreneurship, to grow our own businesses, because this is a skill.

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What you're talking about growing global teams that are talented, that are nimble and agile and skilled.

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That's an important ability for all of us.

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I think it opens more doors to us.

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But for everyone who's worried about where we're going, aaron, what's your take on all of these macro trends?

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Yeah, wow, that's a great question.

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Those are some great questions packed into that, so I'll do my best to address at least a few of them.

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And, of course, the caveat to all of this is I have no idea, right, none of us really know.

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And one of the most humble things I've learned in my career is that you can only assess things from a probabilistic standpoint and you can only look at what is then not to your point before the market loves to find a consensus and then price that consensus in, and the way you make money in the market is to see if you think that that price is overly extrapolating, something that is not necessarily going to happen, and then you can discern, maybe, what is an alternative path.

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So, for example, you know AI might be a good example.

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So AI is clearly happening.

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Ai might be a good example.

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So AI is clearly happening.

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It's clearly this massive tectonic force that's going to change the way all work is done, all entrepreneurs function, and it's already doing that, right.

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But the nuance comes to what degree, how and over what time horizon, and I think there are some countervailing forces that are at play in addition to that that are also guaranteed, like, the thing about demographics is super interesting in finance is it's guaranteed outcome for 20 years at least.

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It's a generationally guaranteed outcome.

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There's no way that we can change demographics, at least you know, for a couple more generations out, and we have to do it quite deliberately at that if we want to do that.

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So demographics it's boring and people in finance don't like studying it because it's very long term.

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These things happen slowly over time, but what we've seen is that the decline in labor forces as the boomer generation retires and as highly skilled labor cannot replace that quick enough, that you've seen a lot of a shortage, shortages in various industries, and you've also seen that shortage not just because of demographics but because of people, because of cultural reasons, frankly, because people don't want to do certain tasks anymore and immigration used to be the way in which those problems were resolved.

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Though that has become politicized in a world that's extremely partisan and, as a result, immigration has become this very charged issue and, as a result, immigration has become this very charged issue and often, if you look at Japan, if you look at Europe, you look at countries that are really, really struggling demographically, where immigration has become even more of a difficult issue.

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That's why here in the US, it could also end up in that direction eventually.

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We're in a slightly better position than much of the rest of the Western world in that sense, but Latin America is in a different boat.

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Their demographics are also starting to shift, but they're better than most of the Western world.

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So that's one and two.

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I mentioned the education, the investment in education.

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That's key to any successful, thriving socioeconomic system.

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But what you're going to see, the bet that we're making, what I really truly believe is going to happen, is that you're absolutely right, which is that there's going to be more and more entrepreneurship.

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And why is that?

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Because there's more ability to specialize.

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The world just continues to hyper-specialize.

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That's really the entire story of civilization and economics is specialization.

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We specialize and we built agricultural systems, and those agricultural systems allowed us to save surplus food, and that allowed us to free up time to build more specializations, and we basically just continued in that direction ever since.

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So we are going to continue to specialize.

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That's what technology allows us to do, and in doing so, that creates more and more opportunity for small businesses to find ways to solve problems that you know.

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Everyone talks about how the network effect is creating this movement towards.

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You know, the bigger getting bigger, and that's true in a certain sense, but there's also this kind of complete polarity to that, which is there's all this room for small entrepreneurs to find niche ways of adding value, and to that end, those entrepreneurs are going to need to find interesting ways to expand and to scale, and in a labor market that is really struggling to deliver those values for employers, this is where you need to start thinking differently, and I think the problem is that most entrepreneurs have gotten so accustomed to just thinking myopically that the labor force that they have to adhere to is just here in their backyard, when everything else that we do is global.

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So why should labor not be global?

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And now, what COVID did was, of course, it opened up the door to remote work.

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So previously, all of this offshoring was done at the multinational level.

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So multinational corporations were building subsidiaries in India, in Asia, in China, obviously, and it was happening at the manufacturing level, at the production and the industrial part of the production process, and that's because there's a lot of capital that was required to do that, but it was worth it because there was such an arbitrage in the cost of labor, and that's where globalization gets kind of it's.

00:22:12.511 --> 00:22:19.464
It's that's what drove globalization, but it's also where globalization kind of gets its bad rep right.

00:22:20.146 --> 00:22:23.362
But what we're seeing now since covet is that now everyone can do this.

00:22:23.362 --> 00:22:32.249
Everyone can um, the, the, basically the palette is completely unlocked and that every, every, every small business.

00:22:32.249 --> 00:22:34.967
You don't have to be a multinational corporation to do this.

00:22:34.967 --> 00:22:46.446
We can get into the ways in which you can hire, because a lot of people feel a little bit of reticence or they feel a little intimidated by well, how do I even hire someone overseas?

00:22:46.446 --> 00:22:47.148
What's the process?

00:22:47.148 --> 00:22:49.701
There's ways that you can do so with an employer record.

00:22:49.701 --> 00:22:52.307
You can do so just through typical contracting.

00:22:52.307 --> 00:22:56.144
That's how most small businesses and even medium-sized businesses hire.

00:22:56.144 --> 00:22:57.489
They hire on a contract basis.

00:22:57.489 --> 00:22:58.711
They're paying in dollars.

00:22:58.711 --> 00:23:07.203
Most of these employees want to get paid in dollars, frankly, and so the process is actually much more easy than people realize.

00:23:07.223 --> 00:23:10.971
So I think to kind of try to tie all that into your question.

00:23:10.971 --> 00:23:16.230
I think that's why I believe the second wave of COVID, the first wave, was okay.

00:23:16.230 --> 00:23:19.042
Remote is an option, and not only is remote an option.

00:23:19.042 --> 00:23:24.541
I now have the option to kind of reinvent who I am from a career perspective.

00:23:24.541 --> 00:23:31.161
So many people went through this transformation of saying I had this nine to five job but I actually don't need to earn a living that way.

00:23:31.161 --> 00:23:32.967
There's lots of different ways I can earn a living.

00:23:32.967 --> 00:23:37.070
There's lots of different ways I can kind of build different income streams to do so.

00:23:37.070 --> 00:23:40.401
And the second wave, I believe, is going to be okay.

00:23:40.401 --> 00:23:45.532
Now, how do I scale that, how do I delegate, how do I expand my horizons?

00:23:45.532 --> 00:23:54.386
And I'm like, wow, there's a whole world of really talented people available to help me that I was not even aware of, and that's where I think we can help.

00:23:55.039 --> 00:23:58.230
Yeah, aaron, so much good stuff to unpack and huge kudos to you.

00:23:58.230 --> 00:24:02.251
I know it was a loaded question, but you navigated us through all those considerations.

00:24:02.251 --> 00:24:04.627
Listeners are really familiar with Laura from our team.

00:24:04.627 --> 00:24:06.006
I'm going to shout out Laura Chavez.

00:24:06.006 --> 00:24:07.262
I frequently call her out.

00:24:07.262 --> 00:24:08.226
She's based in Colombia.

00:24:08.226 --> 00:24:16.829
I frequently call her out, she's based in Columbia and she was really someone who, when she came on board behind the scenes at this podcast, we were able to expand from a three-day-a-week show to a five-day-a-week show.

00:24:16.829 --> 00:24:18.876
She creates so much of our back-end processes.

00:24:18.876 --> 00:24:20.683
She recruits amazing guests.

00:24:20.683 --> 00:24:29.832
She finds them proactively for us to interview here on the show and, with all of that in mind, it's fun for me because it feels like we have a really tight knit team.

00:24:29.832 --> 00:24:31.013
We do quarterly retreats.

00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:32.727
At the beginning of the year we were in Los Angeles.

00:24:32.727 --> 00:24:44.180
At the end of Q or beginning of Q2, we were in Medellin and we're going to be going to Boston this fall, and so there's so many exciting things which, to your point, the old way of doing things was talent in your backyard.

00:24:44.180 --> 00:24:49.968
The old way of marketing used to be putting up a billboard on your local interstate or things like that.

00:24:49.968 --> 00:24:54.153
But you're right, we're so used to those global opportunities.

00:24:54.153 --> 00:24:56.902
Why not extrapolate it to the way that we build our teams?

00:24:56.902 --> 00:25:09.987
But I want to ask you this because it just seems to me like so much of your professional career really thrived through hard times that's the way that I'm going to phrase it because obviously, the global financial crisis was something that you navigated.

00:25:10.689 --> 00:25:18.351
The pandemic in 2020, the global pandemic that, in and of itself, was a huge crash in so many different ways, but also huge opportunities.

00:25:18.351 --> 00:25:28.207
When we look at history, the great depression is what created so many new millionaires and so, with that in mind, talk to us about how we, as entrepreneurs, business owners, can tap into this.

00:25:28.207 --> 00:25:29.671
What does it actually look like?

00:25:29.671 --> 00:25:36.488
You and I are both praising the impacts of growing a global team, but for people who have never taken that step, what's it look like?

00:25:36.488 --> 00:25:37.471
What's it feel like?

00:25:37.471 --> 00:25:39.047
How do we communicate with them?

00:25:39.047 --> 00:25:41.048
How do we make sure we get the right person?

00:25:41.048 --> 00:25:42.924
Obviously, ivy League, global Talent.

00:25:42.924 --> 00:25:45.051
You guys talk about being a white glove service.

00:25:45.051 --> 00:25:50.907
How do you make sure you get the right people on the right teams operating in the right way to actually do business the right way?

00:25:52.210 --> 00:25:58.306
Yeah, brian, that's a perfect question and that's very much top of mind with all the clients that we talk to.

00:25:58.306 --> 00:26:06.605
Like I said, there's certainly a sense of inertia about making this shift for some business owners.

00:26:06.605 --> 00:26:08.769
For some not so much, some are already used to it.

00:26:08.769 --> 00:26:21.691
Some have worked, you know, hiring, you know for project oriented ways in the past, or maybe they have a VA in the Philippines that they've used, or they've experienced call centers in India, you know.

00:26:21.691 --> 00:26:23.866
So they've kind of had that sprinkle of exposure.

00:26:24.348 --> 00:26:42.772
But it's a little bit of a different animal when you're saying I want somebody who will have certain control, maybe of certain financial information in my company, or even just they'll have quite a bit of hands-on exposure to the source of revenue, what drives our business.

00:26:42.772 --> 00:26:44.721
So it's a little bit of a different animal.

00:26:44.721 --> 00:26:47.612
So, 100% you need to find someone you can trust.

00:26:47.612 --> 00:26:53.691
My response, however, would be that is always the case, that should always be the case for anyone you ever hire.

00:26:53.691 --> 00:27:03.310
And in hiring someone in Mexico City is no different than hiring someone in, you know, tucson, arizona.

00:27:03.310 --> 00:27:06.765
I mean, especially once you've made the leap to remote.

00:27:06.765 --> 00:27:12.163
Once you've made the leap to remote, the trust is already something that needs to be impeccable.

00:27:12.163 --> 00:27:20.212
Now, I would say it needs to be impeccable in person, but some people might argue that in person there are more obvious checks and balances.

00:27:20.212 --> 00:27:22.646
I personally don't agree with that.

00:27:22.646 --> 00:27:29.686
Well, I think it depends on the type of business, so it's hard to make overly broad generalizations about this.

00:27:29.686 --> 00:27:40.826
Obviously, if you have a brick and mortar business, there's just certain types of businesses that are going to not have as much opportunity to make these modifications as other businesses.

00:27:40.826 --> 00:27:47.280
So if you are not a remote business, if you are in person, there still might be aspects of your business that you can start to hire remotely, for.

00:27:47.280 --> 00:27:52.622
There's lots of creative solutions that I think entrepreneurs often don't even think about in that regard.

00:27:52.622 --> 00:28:00.042
But certainly if you are a hybrid or fully remote organization, the shifts you can make are obvious.

00:28:01.645 --> 00:28:06.623
The types of roles we tend to see are the most common, that are, you know, of interest.

00:28:06.623 --> 00:28:07.344
We would say.

00:28:07.344 --> 00:28:11.863
Well, I'll caveat this by saying we don't do a lot in the software and engineering space.

00:28:11.863 --> 00:28:13.876
We think that's a very saturated world.

00:28:13.876 --> 00:28:16.782
It's also, just frankly, not our area of expertise.

00:28:16.782 --> 00:28:20.458
And to your question before how do you make sure you're hiring the right person?

00:28:20.458 --> 00:28:34.916
Well, we want to make sure that we have the expertise to do so, and engineering is just such a technical industry and such a technical role that you really need to make sure that you're hiring the right people for that.

00:28:34.916 --> 00:28:44.402
So maybe in the future we'll move in that direction, but right now we find plenty of opportunity closer to the revenue, I would say closer to earnings.

00:28:44.442 --> 00:28:48.642
When someone's trying to scale their business, when someone's trying to grow, what are the first things they need to spend dollars?

00:28:48.642 --> 00:28:49.705
What's the best ROI?

00:28:49.705 --> 00:28:51.578
It's usually sales and marketing right.

00:28:51.578 --> 00:28:52.721
So that's first and foremost.

00:28:52.721 --> 00:29:02.652
And in Latin America, mexico, argentina, especially those countries, there's already such a strong cultural connection to the US.

00:29:02.652 --> 00:29:08.224
You'd be shocked at the talent that you find that is hyper fluent in English.

00:29:08.224 --> 00:29:30.935
They speak English better than a lot of Americans, I know, and they speak with almost no accent too, which might sound like a superficial point, but it's often an issue actually in countries like India or the Philippines, where they have very strong English because it's an English speaking country, it's a second, it's, you know, literally built into their, their system, in their school system, to be taught that language.

00:29:30.935 --> 00:29:42.469
But the accents are very strong and it's sometimes difficult for Americans to understand them, and that doesn't necessarily matter in certain functions, but if you're customer facing, that's very important.

00:29:45.479 --> 00:29:47.683
So you know some of the things that we study.

00:29:47.683 --> 00:29:49.688
Of course, we do background checks, just like anyone.

00:29:49.688 --> 00:29:50.476
You know.

00:29:50.476 --> 00:29:55.077
That's really kind of ubiquitously done no matter where you're hiring, anywhere in the world.

00:29:55.077 --> 00:29:55.640
That should be done.

00:29:55.640 --> 00:29:56.839
That should be part of the process.

00:29:56.839 --> 00:30:02.395
Background checks we also just have a very robust pre-screening process on our end.

00:30:02.395 --> 00:30:07.587
The most important thing, too, is to just to really understand what your client needs.

00:30:07.587 --> 00:30:11.726
What are they looking for, what are the non-negotiables, what are the nice to haves?

00:30:11.726 --> 00:30:23.719
So that's kind of recruiting one-on-one type of stuff, but it applies universally and I think when you're dealing specifically with offshore, you really need to build trust.

00:30:23.719 --> 00:30:25.724
You really need to make sure culturally it's a good fit.

00:30:25.724 --> 00:30:31.928
You need to make sure that all those pre-screenings are in place.

00:30:33.154 --> 00:30:55.930
But what I have found is that so for example I'm just going to use kind of a generalization so let's say you want to hire a senior marketing person to help you build out your performance marketing, to help build out your branding, your digital marketing all the types of things that you would typically hire for that role someone who's actually really good at their job here in the US.

00:30:55.930 --> 00:31:02.477
That will probably cost you somewhere between $150,000 and $300,000 a year gross US dollar salary.

00:31:02.477 --> 00:31:14.548
Right In Latin America you could find someone with that same level of experience, with that same skillset, probably in the $40,000 to $60,000 US dollar range.

00:31:14.548 --> 00:31:17.259
Okay, so obviously a significant difference.

00:31:17.601 --> 00:31:24.125
What's interesting though that might sound like, oh, you're just taking advantage of different people, I would argue the opposite.

00:31:24.125 --> 00:31:29.776
I would argue you're giving someone an opportunity who would otherwise not have that opportunity to work for a great team such as yourself.

00:31:29.776 --> 00:31:36.096
If you believe in yourself, you should believe that hiring someone else can really help bring them up.

00:31:36.096 --> 00:31:42.590
Now imagine if you paid somebody who expected to get paid at the best job they could get locally in their economy.

00:31:42.590 --> 00:31:44.714
You know the equivalent of $50,000.

00:31:44.714 --> 00:31:55.527
If you paid them $60,000 or $70,000, of course I'm just making this up as an example, but these numbers are, you know, pretty accurate reflection of the reality.

00:31:55.527 --> 00:32:07.270
And how loyal would that employee be that they're making 20%, 30% above what they otherwise would be making, working for a great team, working for a great US entity with a great culture.

00:32:08.255 --> 00:32:10.743
So loyalty is very important.

00:32:10.743 --> 00:32:12.335
Retention is very important.

00:32:12.335 --> 00:32:15.477
That's another theme we haven't really touched on Post-COVID.

00:32:15.477 --> 00:32:24.269
Not only finding talent, but retaining talent has been a huge, huge struggle for companies all across the spectrum, from Fortune 500 companies all the way down to mom and pops.

00:32:24.269 --> 00:32:43.029
So being able to decipher and find candidates who are eager, who want to learn, who want to grow, who have lots of skills and really thrive on stability and loyalty it's not so easy to find that anymore here in the US.

00:32:43.029 --> 00:32:46.902
It's much easier, honestly, to find it there.

00:32:46.902 --> 00:32:50.537
So that's kind of been our process and our experience so far.

00:32:50.537 --> 00:32:53.246
Hopefully I answered at least some of your questions.

00:32:53.674 --> 00:32:54.116
For sure.

00:32:54.116 --> 00:33:04.977
You did, aaron, actually, to the point where I so strongly want to echo so many of these incredible points that you're making, because, as someone who's always looking, I have a portfolio of different businesses and different industries.

00:33:04.977 --> 00:33:22.307
Just the nature of being an entrepreneur for 16 years at this point is that I'm always looking to grow my teams and it is extraordinarily difficult to find good talent anywhere, and so the fact that we're going to drop your link in just a few minutes here, but the fact that you all are able to, I think that it's really powerful.

00:33:22.307 --> 00:33:34.146
Actually, I do want to kick it your way for you to talk about this instead of it coming from me, because it's something I was so impressed with about the process that you all use at Ivy League, which is it's all laid out so beautifully on your website.

00:33:34.194 --> 00:33:43.537
Someone can literally click, start hiring, and you all have a really strong way of assessing what are your actual needs, what are the things that you all value.

00:33:43.537 --> 00:33:49.276
You guys then go out and find that talent and match who you feel are the best candidates.

00:33:49.276 --> 00:33:57.285
Talk to us about that process because for a lot of people, I hope I genuinely hope, as someone who believes in this stuff personally and uses it in all of my businesses.

00:33:57.285 --> 00:34:03.566
I hope that this is the catalyst and people saying let me try, let me see what some talent injected into my business can do.

00:34:03.566 --> 00:34:05.415
Talk to us about that process, aaron.

00:34:06.657 --> 00:34:08.822
Yeah, thank you for that question.

00:34:08.822 --> 00:34:10.847
So, and thank you for those kind of words.

00:34:10.847 --> 00:34:14.083
Yeah, so you know our website, for example.

00:34:14.083 --> 00:34:20.465
Just that, you know, that's a great way of getting preliminary information that allows us to have a have a framework from which to operate.

00:34:20.465 --> 00:34:30.054
Of course, we then want to have a detailed conversation with you, but the process is pretty straightforward.

00:34:30.054 --> 00:34:33.159
We have a team of recruiters down locally in these countries.

00:34:33.159 --> 00:34:51.148
So I think that's one thing that a lot of people who try to do this miss, which is that you do need a local presence, you do need boots on the ground, and so we have a team of amazing recruiters that we work with, both in-house and that we partner with, that help us source.

00:34:51.248 --> 00:35:26.710
Now, one of the things my brother-in-law I mentioned Ari, how he built many businesses using a lot of these strategies on his own, and one thing he discovered just intuitively over the years was was there were certain universities, there were certain programs, there were certain cities near those universities that tended to have, you know, higher caliber talent, because, again, like you said, it's always hard to find, uh, good talent anywhere, um, but it's certainly a challenge to do so when you're straying from your own backyard, right, it's like imagine trying to buy a house in a city you don't live in.

00:35:26.710 --> 00:35:28.717
It's a whole new set of challenges.

00:35:28.717 --> 00:35:31.556
You don't know the right neighborhoods, you don't know a lot of the nuances.

00:35:31.556 --> 00:35:42.958
So, having that local presence, having people who've done this before and know what to look out for, know the red flags, know the green flags right, know all the things that point to a good candidate.

00:35:42.958 --> 00:36:08.250
So then what we do after we screen this process, after we have this preliminary conversation with a prospective client, we then usually our process is to find three or four candidates that we think are going to fit that to a T and we'll kind of use our network locally again, using our university systems, using our network of recruiters that have built teams this way in the past, including ourselves.

00:36:08.474 --> 00:36:22.416
You know we also act almost like a consultant too often for a lot of businesses in so much so, for example, we had a client the other day who is he's looking kind of for a chief of staff type role but he also wants a content creator.

00:36:22.416 --> 00:36:24.402
So you know we were helping him navigate.

00:36:24.402 --> 00:36:27.159
You know what, what the best order of operation should be.

00:36:27.159 --> 00:36:34.184
Okay, you know what you know, because you're not going to find someone who can do all of these different tasks like very well.

00:36:34.184 --> 00:36:49.251
You can maybe find a great jack of all trades that will be a good executive assistant, but to find someone who you really need to be an amazing financial analyst but also be on top of accounting issues and certain administrative and operational things.

00:36:49.251 --> 00:36:54.206
It's going to be hard to find someone who can do all that in one Not to say that you can't.

00:36:54.206 --> 00:36:57.543
But so sometimes you know it's a process.

00:36:57.663 --> 00:37:04.947
When you want to scale you, everyone kind of wants to get to where they, where they want to be, but sometimes it requires maybe one, two, three hires.

00:37:04.947 --> 00:37:16.110
But you need to prioritize those hires first, because often that first hire is going to have a very powerful influence on the subsequent hires too.

00:37:16.110 --> 00:37:18.061
So you want to make sure you get that first one right too.

00:37:18.061 --> 00:37:22.465
So there's a lot of consulting that we do kind of just as part of the process.

00:37:22.465 --> 00:37:25.963
Some employers have a better sense of what they want, some don't.

00:37:25.963 --> 00:37:29.905
So you know it's going to really vary on a situational basis.

00:37:29.905 --> 00:37:47.184
But I would say that, yeah, we tend to use all of our networks, use our local presence, and we already have candidates that we kind of are always, you know are keeping track of different candidates that we think are going to be all-stars.

00:37:47.184 --> 00:37:54.585
I mean, we really pride ourselves in saying like this might sound cheesy or cliche, but we pride ourselves in saying like we're going to find the top 1% and I think that's the challenge.

00:37:54.675 --> 00:37:59.567
You know, when you go on Upwork or you go on Fiverr, it's really a game of roulette.

00:37:59.567 --> 00:38:06.083
Of course, there's reviews, there's different tools you can use there and again, it's also a different process.

00:38:06.083 --> 00:38:10.480
You're maybe hiring that person to help you build a website or do some project.

00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:13.000
That's gonna require a week of work or a month of work.

00:38:13.000 --> 00:38:16.661
This is very different when you're saying I wanna hire a team member.

00:38:17.355 --> 00:38:18.057
You know you talk.

00:38:18.057 --> 00:38:22.454
You said her name is Laura, right, yeah.

00:38:22.454 --> 00:38:23.237
So team member, you know you talk.

00:38:23.237 --> 00:38:25.063
You said her name is Laura, right, yeah, so you talked about hiring Laura.

00:38:25.063 --> 00:38:26.248
She is now like part of your family, I would imagine.

00:38:26.248 --> 00:38:26.389
Right.

00:38:26.389 --> 00:38:30.302
I mean, in essence, like that is something that can.

00:38:30.302 --> 00:38:34.192
That hire could have made or broken the.

00:38:34.192 --> 00:38:35.976
You know the trajectory of your business.

00:38:35.976 --> 00:38:37.438
It makes all the difference.

00:38:37.438 --> 00:38:38.960
So you really need to get that right.

00:38:38.960 --> 00:39:07.684
It's not like using Upwork or Fiverr or anything like that, and so we really pride ourselves on going through that filtration process, getting to those three or four candidates and then filtering it down from there Our own interview records to help them fashion the right questions to be asking and really help them discern what are the things that they should be looking for.

00:39:08.545 --> 00:39:12.766
Yeah, gosh, aaron, I really appreciate all of those insights and the way that you all work.

00:39:12.766 --> 00:39:15.947
It's easy to look at you guys as a headhunter agency.

00:39:15.947 --> 00:39:18.168
I would argue it's not those terms at all.

00:39:18.168 --> 00:39:23.670
You guys really seem like you are hiring partners because of that consultative process that you talked about.

00:39:23.670 --> 00:39:24.251
It really is.

00:39:24.451 --> 00:39:28.873
Let me set you up for success and to your point about our own beloved Laura here behind the scenes.

00:39:28.873 --> 00:39:30.173
Listeners also love her.

00:39:30.173 --> 00:39:37.820
She makes such a big impact here at the show because she's been on multiple episodes of this show and so many listeners know that she powers so much of it.

00:39:37.820 --> 00:39:46.219
So, to your point, it's not just a question of who do I have for this project, it's what's going to set the right corporate culture, what's going to create this team culture that we're all looking for.

00:39:46.219 --> 00:39:58.041
And again I just want to echo someone who has used Upwork for a long time, back in the days when it was still called Elancer, all the way back in the Tim Ferriss four-hour workweek days, is that Upwork has also changed.

00:39:58.041 --> 00:40:09.168
That's so much more difficult these days because of AI, all these proposals that come in with chat, gpt, cover letters it's only more difficult now than ever before to tell where's the talent?

00:40:09.168 --> 00:40:14.121
So huge kudos to you and Ari for the way that you've built Ivy League and the way that you serve your clients.

00:40:14.635 --> 00:40:25.896
Gosh, I feel like you could do a multiple day long webinar about all of these things and we'd still only be touching the tip of the iceberg, which is why I really love this last question that I ask at every episode, which is super broad.

00:40:25.896 --> 00:40:31.378
You can take it in any way that you want to, as a subject matter expert or just as a fellow entrepreneur.

00:40:31.378 --> 00:40:39.041
Aaron, what's the one thing you hope every listener walks away from today's episode with, knowing that they're at all different stages of their own business growth?

00:40:39.041 --> 00:40:40.143
You're one of us.

00:40:40.143 --> 00:40:41.425
You're a fellow entrepreneur.

00:40:41.425 --> 00:40:44.815
What's that one thing you want to impart on them at the end of today's conversation?

00:40:46.579 --> 00:40:46.940
Yeah, brian.

00:40:46.940 --> 00:40:50.268
Well, first of all, thank you for this dialogue, man.

00:40:50.268 --> 00:40:54.181
It's been really fun and I'll actually leave you with two.

00:40:54.181 --> 00:41:01.664
So one is you mentioned a moment ago that this is a process.

00:41:01.664 --> 00:41:05.199
It's not, like you know, like just a typical headhunter agency, and I and I totally agree.

00:41:05.199 --> 00:41:09.217
So thank you for kind of noticing that I do not think of myself as a recruiter.

00:41:09.217 --> 00:41:10.701
I've never been in that world.

00:41:10.701 --> 00:41:12.403
I'm not an HR person.

00:41:13.126 --> 00:41:25.943
That being said, I think the message that I've come to appreciate the message that my brother-in-law knew intuitively from the beginning that helped him succeed so well is that every entrepreneur, at the end of the day, is a recruiter.

00:41:25.943 --> 00:41:29.500
We all need to have that skillset to hire.

00:41:29.500 --> 00:41:37.626
If you want to grow, if you want to just have a side project or a hustle and you want to be a one man lone wolf or one woman lone wolf, that's great.

00:41:37.626 --> 00:41:46.565
But you're going to run into some type of plateau eventually, either through burnout, or you're just going to stop growing at some point.

00:41:46.565 --> 00:41:54.086
We all need teams to grow and build, we need to delegate and we need to manage.

00:41:54.086 --> 00:42:01.922
So a lot of entrepreneurs intuitively know that they need to be good managers, but they don't necessarily realize that they also need to be good hiring managers.

00:42:01.922 --> 00:42:19.449
And what we view is our ability not just to help you expand your horizons globally, to look for that talent, but also to help you navigate that role that you're going to have as a founder CEO, as a hiring manager as well.

00:42:20.356 --> 00:42:25.641
So that's the first thing I would say is I think we all need to accept, you know, is that we all are recruiters.

00:42:25.641 --> 00:42:33.472
Number two I would say is, you know, just based on my personal journey, I wish I'd kind of gone down this path sooner.

00:42:33.472 --> 00:42:51.181
So I would just say to anyone who feels that they might have golden handcuffs or feels that they might, um, not be able to actualize something at the moment because maybe they have family obligations or they have there's, there's always going to be something stopping you.

00:42:51.181 --> 00:43:10.409
And I would just say, if you have an idea, if you have a passion and it's continues to to to kind of creep in to your psyche that you should listen to it, because life is short, it really is and there will always be a reason to say no.

00:43:10.409 --> 00:43:23.755
There will always be an excuse to push something off to another time, and I know that might sound a little bit like coachy or cheerleader-ish, but it's just been my experience, so I feel compelled to say that as well.

00:43:24.396 --> 00:43:39.496
Yeah, I really appreciate those insights and I'll say on your behalf for listeners that, with two kids of your own including a newborn congrats again you really practice what you preach and that is such a great takeaway there that there will always be reasons to kick the can down the road.

00:43:39.496 --> 00:43:42.085
There will always be reasons to say no, not yet.

00:43:42.085 --> 00:43:44.163
But gosh, that's the real stuff, aaron.

00:43:44.163 --> 00:43:50.626
We so appreciate you sharing it with us, but I also personally very much appreciate that you've done that in your own professional journey.

00:43:50.626 --> 00:44:02.987
So huge kudos to you and also a huge shout out to Ari, who's not here with us today, but I know that he's such a core part of what you guys are building behind the scenes at Ivy League, so I really appreciate all the work that you're doing to help others grow With.

00:44:02.987 --> 00:44:10.581
That said, drop those links on us, aaron, for listeners who I hope that this is the catalyst, the kick up their butt to go, start seeking that global talent.

00:44:10.581 --> 00:44:14.356
Where should they go from here to take advantage of all the great stuff that you and Ari are doing?

00:44:15.717 --> 00:44:19.219
Yeah, first of all, I also want to shout out Pilar, who is our Laura.

00:44:19.219 --> 00:44:30.228
You know she's working with our team and she works vitally every day behind the scenes, and she's amazing too, so I definitely want to give her some kudos as well.

00:44:30.228 --> 00:44:31.068
But thank you for that.

00:44:31.068 --> 00:44:35.692
The best way to get in contact with us is idleaglobaltalentcom.

00:44:35.692 --> 00:44:49.300
You can also check me out on LinkedIn, or I am on Twitter, though I don't really use it so much these days.

00:44:49.300 --> 00:44:56.668
It's at Ludi L-U-D-I-M-A-G-I-S-T-R, at Ludi, magister, but the best way to reach me is going to be LinkedIn, and the best way to reach our company is through our website.

00:44:56.668 --> 00:44:58.130
And thank you so much, brian.

00:44:58.530 --> 00:45:00.876
Yes, listeners, you already know the drill.

00:45:00.876 --> 00:45:03.083
We're making it as easy as possible for you to find Aaron's business.

00:45:03.083 --> 00:45:15.077
Ivy League Global Talent is at ivyleagueglobaltalentcom, but no matter where it is that you're tuning into today's episode, if you scroll right on down in the show notes, you'll find that link, as well as a link to Aaron's personal social media accounts.

00:45:15.077 --> 00:45:18.320
You can reach out to him on LinkedIn If you just want to keep this conversation going.

00:45:18.320 --> 00:45:29.302
I genuinely feel like this is only the tip of the iceberg in the ways that Aaron's experiences, insights, strategies and, of course, what he does professionally can help all of us grow, so don't be shy in reaching out.

00:45:29.302 --> 00:45:31.443
Find those links down below in the show notes.

00:45:31.443 --> 00:45:36.668
Otherwise, aaron, on behalf of myself and all the listeners worldwide, thanks so much for coming on the show today.

00:45:36.668 --> 00:45:45.541
Thank you so much, brian hey, it's Brian here and thanks for tuning in to yet another episode of the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.

00:45:45.541 --> 00:45:49.519
If you haven't checked us out online, there's so much good stuff there.

00:45:49.519 --> 00:45:56.284
Check out the show's website and all the show notes that we talked about in today's episode at thewantrepreneurshowcom.

00:45:56.364 --> 00:45:58.737
And I just want to give a shout out to our amazing guests.

00:45:58.737 --> 00:46:07.503
There's a reason why we are ad free and have produced so many incredible episodes five days a week for you, and it's because our guests step up to the plate.

00:46:07.503 --> 00:46:09.563
These are not sponsored episodes.

00:46:09.563 --> 00:46:11.161
These are not infomercials.

00:46:11.161 --> 00:46:14.666
Our guests help us cover the costs of our productions.

00:46:14.666 --> 00:46:25.608
They so deeply believe in the power of getting their message out in front of you, Awesome entrepreneurs and entrepreneurs, that they contribute to help us make these productions possible, in the power of getting their message out in front of you, awesome wantrepreneurs and entrepreneurs, that they contribute to help us make these productions possible.

00:46:25.608 --> 00:46:34.106
So thank you to not only today's guests, but all of our guests in general, and I just want to invite you check out our website because you can send us a voicemail there.

00:46:34.106 --> 00:46:35.440
We also have live chat.

00:46:35.440 --> 00:46:40.085
If you want to interact directly with me, go to thewantrepreneurshowcom.

00:46:40.085 --> 00:46:41.496
Initiatea live chat.

00:46:41.496 --> 00:46:50.880
It's for real me, and I'm excited because I'll see you, as always, every Monday, wednesday, friday, saturday and Sunday here on the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.