914: Balancing LIFE, BUSINESS, and FAMILY while rehumanizing the workplace w/ Jackie Nimer

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Hey, what is up?

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Welcome to this episode of the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.

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As always, I'm your host, brian LoFermento, and we are joined today by an incredible entrepreneur whose work is so deeply meaningful on so many different levels.

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Whether you are a mom and that's one of the things that you're balancing in your professional career or you're not you're just looking to get the most out of all the things that you have the possibilities of doing, then today's guest is really gonna enlighten the way that we view potential and getting the most out of our high-performance goals and objectives, because we all have those as entrepreneurs, while we're also all balancing busy lives with so many other responsibilities.

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So let me tell you about today's guest.

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Her name is Jackie Neimer.

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Jackie is an executive coach, leader, entrepreneur and the co-CEO of People Conduit.

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Jackie's mission is to help leaders, individual contributors and organizations achieve their highest potential by investing into their people, and so much of today's episode is going to talk about the people that play the role in our businesses, in our teams, in the people that we serve with our growth trajectories.

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I love the work that they do at People Conduit.

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In addition to her co-founder, megan, people Conduit provides organizational development, team intelligence and enhancement consulting in mind, performance executive coaching services to clients mostly in the enterprise space.

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So, for all of us small business owners, if you want to get behind the scenes into what's going on inside the world of big business, so we can borrow those and leverage them in our own businesses, jackie's going to give us a lot of insights.

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What's really cool about the work that Jackie and Megan do is they take a holistic and modern approach.

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Their tagline is we put the human back into the business of people, because the digital age has enabled this very dehumanizing aspect in the corporate world.

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And they're so proud of the work they do to help organizations get the best work out of their people, while continuing to prioritize their well-being and development.

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This is an episode that's going to benefit every single one of us, no matter where you are in your growth journey.

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So I'm not going to say anything else.

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Let's dive straight into my interview with Jackie Neimer.

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All right, jackie, there's a high bar for you here today, but we're excited that you're here.

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Welcome to the show.

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Thank you, I'm thrilled to be here.

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I don't know what else I have to talk about.

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You had such a great intro.

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I don't know what else I have to give.

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Well, there's going to be a lot of stuff, because I want you to take it away, because I know that so much of your personal life also drives your views on business and on the way that we can all be our best selves in all the ways.

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So, first things, first take us beyond the bio.

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Who's Jackie?

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How'd you start doing all these incredible things?

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Wow, okay.

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So yeah, I think it's.

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Let me give you an example.

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This is my last 24 hours, if this gives you any idea of the entrepreneurship journey as a mom.

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But what I wanted to do was I really wanted to start something, like you said, with Megan.

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But I am a mom.

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I'm a mom of three.

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I have three small kids eight, six and four.

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I'm divorced, and I do a mom of three.

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I have three small kids eight, six and four.

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I'm divorced, and I do have some help.

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But it's just, it's wild out there for moms, right and like in any adults in this space that are trying to juggle parenthood with being high performers, sometimes it feels like it's in direct conflict with one another.

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So I, you know, even just talking about my last 24 hours, it's been.

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It was my kids' last day of school.

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I was running from meeting to you know early pickup yesterday, to all the afterschool events.

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Then my air conditioning unit went out last night and then we're spending the night at my ex-husband's house and then this morning I come back and my the back of my hair still wet, cause I didn't even have time to pull it together and you know, I don't even have all my long, my dry cleaning or my clothes to wear.

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So that is exactly what it is it's a roller coaster.

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I love every minute of it, but uh, I'm sure fellow entrepreneurs that are listening can relate.

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Yes, and that's the real stuff, truly, jackie, but I do feel I'm going to call out podcasts and YouTube videos and business books, because I feel like everyone talks about the strategies and everyone's obsessed with like marketing funnels and social media hacks, but the truth is, this is the real life stuff that we all need to balance, and I think that that's a perfect way for us to start today's session because obviously, what you and Megan do at People Conduit really reflects the realities of being people inside of business.

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Business doesn't happen in these ideal, hypothetical scenarios where we can all just execute on strategy stuff.

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It really comes down to us being able to perform.

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So let's get to the heart of People Conduit and all these people things that we're talking about in today's episode.

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What does all this stuff mean when it comes to high performance?

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How does all the being a mom and having life responsibilities how does it all fit in together?

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yeah, I think, as we have gotten into this like very corporate environment, we've been programmed to be robotic in in a way, and so when you don't show up as your authentic self to work, you don't have the psychological safety, you don't have the camaraderie that you want, you're not going to I mean, you're not going to get the best out of your people if you won't even allow them to be themselves nor talk about their real life.

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Right, and I think, like we've gotten to this point where you know our work and our mission, the heart of what we do is like shedding those layers again and deprogramming that bullshit.

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Honestly, right, I mean, like we all have lives, we're all human and we've just gotten away from treating people like humans and treating them just like kind of a number in the system, and so we're training leaders to really, basically, I mean, I don't know if you want to call there's all kinds of ways to like lead from the front, lead from the back, whatever your thing is it just be human, you know.

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Talk about your family, be vulnerable, talk about your friends, talk about your hobbies.

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Like you know, don't come across, as some, you know, like very rigid corporate leader that doesn't care about their people, because you know we talk about.

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If you're not investing in your people, then you know we talk about.

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If you're not investing in your people, then you know it's just going to be a constant turnover and that's more costly than investing in the good people that you have.

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Yeah, jackie, I'll tell you what.

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I want to jump right into it, because I know you've got a lot to say on all these topics.

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But you talk about deprogramming First of all.

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I feel like shots fired at society, at our traditional education system, at the way that all of us have been brought up.

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What's that deprogramming consist of?

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First of all?

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What have we been programmed for and what does that deprogramming look like?

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Oh gosh, megan, I probably say that we're deprogramming like 30 times a day because it really is just like shedding the confines of like what we have learned, especially, as you know and I'm going to give you personal examples because I'm a mom, for example.

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I have been I think a lot of women have felt that it hasn't been a safe space to talk about being a mom, right, like you know, people talk about oh, I don't know if she's got time, she's got three small kids, she's got so many commitments, she's this and it's just like you know what, like you know, f, that noise.

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To be quite frank, I can do all the hard things and I can still be a mom of three.

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So that's my personal example.

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But there are so many ways that we've been deprogrammed, or programmed rather to not show up as our real self Right, and it's whether it's, you know, not being funny or not being authentic or not being, like you know, talking to people about, maybe the silly things you like to do or the silly behaviors that you have, because you know, this is my favorite thing and I think this is like the core of how we feel that people come to it.

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But Sarah Blakely always says you can be taken seriously without being serious all the time.

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If you ever saw Megan and I out and about, we look like the goofiest people, but you know we're pretty good at our job still.

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So it's just about being yourself and feeling safe to do so.

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Yeah, and I can already tell just in our limited interactions already, both over email and then here today getting recorded together is that you do mean business, but I also know, having seen your Instagram and just having gone through so much of your work, is that you also are a fun and playful mother.

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You also enjoy the things that you like to do, and what I really what it's something that's come with my own personal maturity, both as a person, but also 16 years of being an entrepreneur is that I realized all of these things can and should coexist together.

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It's and thinking rather than or thinking.

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Talk to us about that, because a lot of people want to create these dichotomies where they say it's this or that, but you fully embrace it.

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I would argue you don't just embrace it in the way you do business, but also in the way that you do life.

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Talk to us about making all the things work all the time simultaneously, because I'm sure there's times where it feels like they're opposing forces.

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Yeah, I think it's all the things don't work all the time.

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So that's what it's getting to, that acceptance I guess I would say because, as a I you know, I'll just say, like middle-aged working parent, you know there are some days where you get to the point and a lot of our clients feel this way right, especially our coach, our coaching clients.

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But it's almost like redefining what balance is, because balance is not like crushing it all the time, right, like balance is crushing it at work one day, crushing it, like you know, in your family dynamic someday, because crushing it as friends someday.

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You know it's not all of the things all in one day and I think like we've been again programmed to think that balance is like, oh, you can have it oh, you can have it all you can have it all, but you can't have it all every day, day after day, and you have to give yourself the grace and basically the forgiveness to just be human again.

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Yeah, I love how you said that, because I think it's something that we need to call out more in the world of entrepreneurship is you can have it all, but maybe not at the same time, as you just shared with us, and I think that that's the real stuff.

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But, going back to, I think it's a combination of three words that pops up already in the way that you've shown up here in today's episode, but also it shows up so much in your work, which is investing in people.

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We're not just talking about investing in ourselves, because you obviously work with executives at so many incredible companies.

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We all you and I, as well as all of our listeners worldwide we are executives in our own rights, no matter where we are in our business growth journey, but we also get to invest in people.

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What does that actually look like?

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Because I feel like it's become a cliche in the business world of investing in people.

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So few people actually practice what they preach.

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So what's that look like?

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Yeah, I'll tell you, the reason that we talk about taking a more modern approach is because, again, by holistic approach meaning I mean we do do some of the traditional you know our C-suite needs some communication enhancement here, stuff like that obviously more traditional coaching.

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But what makes us most proud is the work that we do on an individual level and in these big kind of corporate structures where it's really working with people to help them find fulfillment and purpose.

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And it's not just from the business perspective, right, like, for example, we work with a lot of um, you know we work with for, okay, so we're working with this woman, she's a mom, she's a new mom, she's got a two-year-old and she's navigating the corporate world and it's really been challenging for her showing up as a mom and showing up as a somebody to be taken seriously too, and so it's uh, we work really hard to help our clients find fulfillment and purpose with outside of, I guess, the traditional modalities.

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Right, like you have, like your personality assessments in this.

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Well, we work to.

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You know, we get into some personal stuff and you know it's uncomfortable for people and it has to be, and Megan says this really well because she says, like, discomfort is the currency of growth.

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If you're not willing to talk about all the other things that make you a human, so it's.

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You know your relationships in life, whether it's your partner, your marriage, your friendships, your, your relationship with even money and and uh, with kids, and basically every piece of the puzzle we incorporate into our coaching.

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Because we're one human, you can't only improve one aspect, the work life, and not address the other things, because you're just again going to be caught up in the same cycle of the dichotomy that you mentioned.

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Yeah, I love that you highlighted all the different puzzle pieces, because I feel like way too often, if we are unhappy with our businesses, for example, we think the business is at the root of our problems, but zooming out, we realized no, holy cow, I've not been taking care of myself, I've not been taking time off, I've not been physically active.

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There are so many different things that then extrapolate and leak into all the different other areas of our life.

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So I love that you take that people first approach rather than that business first approach, because I'll also call out I feel like we give weird advice in the world of entrepreneurship, such as follow your passion, and you talk about the words I wrote down.

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You said find your purpose.

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When we talk about that in the world of entrepreneurship, we think that entrepreneurship has to be our purpose, our business has to be our purpose, whereas our purpose comes from all different facets of our lives.

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You're a mom, I'm an uncle, for example, my niece and nephew.

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They're seven-year-old twins.

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They bring so much joy to my life and that's a big part of who I am and how I love to spend my time.

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Talk to us about that, because I do feel like it's watered down advice of finding your purpose within entrepreneurial realms.

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What does it actually mean to you?

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How do we actually go about finding that, knowing that we wear a million different hats in life?

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If you would have asked me a year ago, I would have told you that I just wanted to start my own thing and I didn't want to be held to somebody else's standards anymore in terms of, like, moral, high ground, ethics, that sort of thing.

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I think we've all been tested at some point.

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That's what I would have told you a year ago.

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Today, I would tell you my purpose is not necessarily through the entrepreneurship journey I'm grateful that it has been but really my purpose personally, our purpose as a company, is to help people basically plug back into themselves right, Like stop, like stop doing this robotic sort of going through the motions of the day, and our purpose is to really like help people, right.

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And so I know that sounds, I know that sounds kind of again cliche, but the work we do is so.

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It brings me so much joy and I think, like the energy that we bring to these groups and you know, individual or groups I think people walk away and they're like, oh yeah, like it's the start of a lot of work that they have to do, but it's it turns on a light bulb for them, Like this doesn't have to be done this way, Right, and so it's that awareness level that we like to bring.

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And then you know, hopefully we get to work with these people for the long term.

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But it's honestly just like waking people up and that's like when that light bulb goes off and you're like, oh, shit.

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What am I doing?

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I don't have to live like this.

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I don't have to go through these motions.

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That is like the most rewarding part of the job and that's what we really.

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That's our purpose now, right With now, right With people conduit.

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So it changes, but, uh, the moment, the pride that I have in that moment, is second to none.

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Yeah, well then, jackie, let me ask you this, because sometimes I do feel a bit jaded in this regard, of thinking to myself I can't wake other people up, they need to wake themselves up.

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But you, obviously, you wear a really important hat, which is that of a coach, which is this is exactly why I'm not a coach is because I don't believe I can wake somebody up, but you have that ability to really one, identify it, to ask the right questions and, three, guide them on that path of their own self-discovery.

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What does that actually look like?

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Because you are in front of audiences that probably are at various degrees or stages in their willingness and readiness to open up their eyes.

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What does that look like?

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How do you bring that change about?

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When we start.

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I'll give you an example with our one-on-one coaching, because I think what it does, it throws people when we start, because we don't start by asking them their career goals.

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And so I think when you sign up for coaching like that, you're like oh, I'm going to talk about, like, where I want to be in five years and blah, blah, blah and all the like.

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You know very canned corporate stuff we talk about.

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How do you show up in your family, how do you show up in your relationships?

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Like, what do you, what do you like to do?

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Not what you know, it's just about.

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You went back to.

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You mentioned the identity like being formulate people's identities outside of work.

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So when we start to work with clients, we ask them all of these very charging personal questions and I think that already sets the tone.

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Like, oh, hey, we're different, we're not going to be doing this in a way where you're used to just talking about like, oh, I'd like to be better at communicating in meetings and showing up in meetings like this, and so it already puts people in a very uncomfortable, vulnerable position and that's how you get the work done.

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And honestly, I'll tell you this I mean, we've had people that haven't wanted.

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We've had people fire us.

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You know, if you're not wanting to do that work, then I get it Right.

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But we're also unwilling to basically play this like surface level stuff that isn't going to benefit anybody us or them so we walk away and people walk away.

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If you're not really willing to like, look under the hood, but that's what we.

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We want people to be willing to look under the hood.

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Yeah Well, you're walking me right into what I'm really excited to talk to you about today, jackie, which is the hard stuff, because so much of when I look at the work that you and Megan do, and also, I'll just say, even personality wise, it seems to me like you love the hard stuff and I feel, like so many entrepreneurs and so many people, they shy away from the hard stuff, whether it's hard conversations, hard work, hard.

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You're talking about some longer term stuff that we have to do, and we are an instant gratification society.

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We like things now, and so, with that in mind and I would imagine that being a mom means that you do inevitably, whether you want it or not, jackie you probably have a lot of hard stuff that comes your way.

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Talk to us about your ability to dig in and why that hard stuff matters so much stuff matters so much.

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Gosh, that's a good question.

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I think it's just about establishing trust.

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If I show up, as I mean, you only get one version of me, I think you could probably tell in the little bit of time that we've had together.

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So if you're only seeing one version of me and I'm totally myself and raw and vulnerable and you know I talk a lot about hard things that I went through in my life, like my divorce and my, you know, my path throughout motherhood has been a challenge and just I think, like you know, if you show up knowing that you can be vulnerable, then you can get that out of people Right.

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So I mean, we ask pretty charging questions.

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I don't have any.

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I'm very unapologetic about it.

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We tell people, if you sign up for us to work with us, it's not gonna be easy, it's gonna be uncomfortable, and I think people appreciate that.

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But yeah, there are moments where we have people that say, like I need a minute and it's just because you're looking, you have to move through some of the dark stuff, right, and not everybody likes to do that.

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Again, going back to the instant gratification world and like the sort of numbing agents that we all have, right.

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So, like it's it's, it's hard work to see your shadow and so, but we do it with, alongside of them.

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So hopefully we set a safe space, we create space for it.

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Yeah.

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Well then let me ask you this, because a lot of listeners probably have never experienced this type of coaching.

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When I say the words mind performance executive coaching, a lot of people probably have heard of it before, but they don't know what that actually looks like, and I think you just revealed a core component of it, which is those piercing questions, jackie.

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What does it actually look like working with a coach like that, and if you can give us some examples of some of those piercing, uncomfortable questions?

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Yeah, I can give you some examples.

00:20:01.529 --> 00:20:09.056
I mean, we'll sit down and we'll kind of do a deep dive from, like we have you know whether or not you're connected.

00:20:09.056 --> 00:20:12.173
Like you know what's your religious beliefs, what are your family values, what are your relationship goals?

00:20:12.173 --> 00:20:17.550
Like you know what's your religious beliefs, what are your family values, what are your relationship goals?

00:20:17.550 --> 00:20:19.556
Like and this is all outside of work.

00:20:19.556 --> 00:20:26.076
So we'll ask pretty serious questions like how do you think you and your partner communicate?

00:20:26.076 --> 00:20:28.471
Do you think it's a supportive system?

00:20:28.471 --> 00:20:31.181
I mean, do you think that there's gaps there?

00:20:31.321 --> 00:20:40.171
I mean, and people just talk and we're not therapists, we're coaches, right, so we're trying to challenge people, we are sounding boards don't get me wrong, we have a lot of that.

00:20:40.171 --> 00:20:48.678
But then we have to spin and say, well, do you think it would be worth it to have a conversation with your partner about the imbalance that you're feeling in your home right now?

00:20:48.678 --> 00:20:53.342
Like stuff like that is what people are, they need to hear.

00:20:53.342 --> 00:20:55.268
I guess I will say, and they know they need to hear it.

00:20:55.268 --> 00:20:58.215
But then they're like, oh yeah, no, this is getting real.

00:20:58.215 --> 00:21:06.471
So some of those questions also about like showing up in your family, whether or not you have your, you know again you being an uncle, it's like.

00:21:06.471 --> 00:21:09.164
Are you showing up as an uncle the way you want to?

00:21:09.164 --> 00:21:11.269
Are you supporting your family?

00:21:11.269 --> 00:21:11.630
Are you?

00:21:11.630 --> 00:21:13.353
What's your family dynamic like?

00:21:13.353 --> 00:21:14.795
What would you change what?

00:21:14.795 --> 00:21:16.038
How are they not supporting you?

00:21:16.038 --> 00:21:16.478
How are they?

00:21:16.478 --> 00:21:17.826
How are they supporting you?

00:21:17.826 --> 00:21:26.634
So it's just like getting into all of those life things that allows us to crack open their potential from a career perspective.

00:21:27.397 --> 00:21:27.679
Yeah.

00:21:27.679 --> 00:21:33.693
Well then let's stick on the topic of kids, because two seven-year-olds, no matter what you tell them, they are always going to want to go deeper.

00:21:33.693 --> 00:21:37.147
If you tell them the sky is blue because of this, they'll say, well, why?

00:21:37.147 --> 00:21:48.809
Yeah, jackie, I would imagine some of your work is also with that regards is when you ask someone who's your family showing up in support of you, someone will give a snap judgment and a snap answer.

00:21:48.809 --> 00:21:50.532
Because we're business leaders.

00:21:50.532 --> 00:21:52.016
We're really good at thinking on the fly.

00:21:52.016 --> 00:21:53.699
We're really good at providing answers.

00:21:53.699 --> 00:21:55.982
How do you get beneath that surface level?

00:21:55.982 --> 00:21:58.288
You've mentioned vulnerability quite a few times here today.

00:21:58.288 --> 00:22:04.915
How do you make sure you keep going deep enough to get to that real stuff that maybe even your clients don't realize in the moment?

00:22:07.586 --> 00:22:09.971
Yeah again, it's just it's peeling back the layers.

00:22:09.971 --> 00:22:13.417
I mean I will call people out and say is that really how you feel?

00:22:13.417 --> 00:22:23.355
Because you know you look like you want to say more or you look like you're uncomfortable even saying it that way, and so it's really just yeah, why?

00:22:23.355 --> 00:22:23.875
Why?

00:22:23.875 --> 00:22:28.593
I mean it's basically the grown up toddler version of why do you feel that way?

00:22:28.593 --> 00:22:29.789
Why are you thinking that way?

00:22:29.789 --> 00:22:43.278
It's just really just asking follow-up questions and then digging deeper every time and I'll give you this corporate example too we do a lot of like team intelligence enhancement, which is also work that we really like to do.

00:22:43.278 --> 00:22:54.913
This is one of my favorite things, but we come into groups and I think they're very used to having the very traditional again corporate training.

00:22:54.972 --> 00:23:15.752
right, you go to an offsite, so for example, we're doing this offsite next week with this company with 16 leaders, and so we worked with this leader and he said, you know, they're very used to having like the very traditional you know, let's do this team building activity, let's do this, and it's like great, like all that stuff is fun, like you need to have fun doing those things at work.

00:23:15.752 --> 00:23:27.358
But then I don't think what they're going to expect is some of the things that we ask and we lead these discussions because, again, like we have to get under the hood and we have to de-layer.

00:23:27.358 --> 00:23:36.618
So we ask the leader to go first and then we give examples, but we ask pretty charging questions just to get that, to establish that deeper connection between colleagues.

00:23:36.618 --> 00:23:41.595
So, for example, it'd be like what's been the most challenging thing you've ever, you know, experienced in your life?

00:23:41.634 --> 00:23:43.489
Well, you know, we all have stuff.

00:23:43.489 --> 00:23:55.326
You know, like I talk about my divorce, my business partner talks about losing a sibling, like we want to establish that space right on so that people feel that it's an area to talk about themselves from a personal level.

00:23:55.326 --> 00:24:06.531
Right, and so when you lead by example, we typically, it typically allows for that flow, and then when we don't get it.

00:24:06.531 --> 00:24:10.445
We'll say well, what, what else are you feeling like, what else have you gone through?

00:24:10.445 --> 00:24:13.131
Or you know, it's just really just asking the same question.

00:24:13.131 --> 00:24:14.994
It's reframing, that's what it is.

00:24:14.994 --> 00:24:15.936
It's reframing.

00:24:16.458 --> 00:24:24.894
Yeah, listeners, I'm going to call this out because we can all borrow this strategy from Jackie in our own businesses and our own sales conversations with our own teams.

00:24:24.894 --> 00:24:26.017
Is that, jackie?

00:24:26.017 --> 00:24:30.415
I mean even I'll use your divorce as the example, even hearing how freely you talk about your divorce?

00:24:30.415 --> 00:24:49.633
So, for example, I have called off an engagement previously and I find that, whether it's in the dating world or whether it's just in friendship circles, when I bring that up, everyone else is kind of like oh man, now I can throw my stuff out there because Brian's called off a divorce, and so I think that's really important and so, yeah, you leading that way.

00:24:49.785 --> 00:24:58.308
Here we are talking about your ability as a coach to get other people to be vulnerable, but it starts with you, and I love the responsibility that you take upon yourself in that process.

00:24:58.308 --> 00:25:08.416
I want to ask you where this starts, because we all, as business owners, as business leaders, we have a million different responsibilities and things that we're focusing on.

00:25:08.416 --> 00:25:11.609
I think it's fascinating that you work a lot at the enterprise level.

00:25:11.609 --> 00:25:19.470
What is it inside of these executive leaders that makes them say you know what, even with all this stuff going on, now's the time for me to invest in me.

00:25:19.470 --> 00:25:21.777
Now's the time for me to become a better leader.

00:25:21.777 --> 00:25:23.309
What's sparking that?

00:25:23.309 --> 00:25:27.444
What's that that ignition for them to invest in themselves and make that change?

00:25:28.605 --> 00:25:47.919
Yeah, I think it's, like you know, in a downturn like we're experiencing right now, I think what people again going back to the deprogramming but people have been programmed to be like you know what, if I put my head down and I do good work and I only show up as my professional, very buttoned up self, the company will take care of me, right?

00:25:47.919 --> 00:25:50.721
Well, that's not really the case, right?

00:25:50.721 --> 00:26:00.789
I mean, and I don't mean it in like a jaded way, but you have to, you have to be your own number one.

00:26:00.789 --> 00:26:02.599
And I don't mean that in a selfish way, I mean that in a take care of yourself sort of way.

00:26:02.599 --> 00:26:09.090
It goes back to, like, you know, put your own mask on before you do somebody else's, you know, but it's you can't help other people.

00:26:09.090 --> 00:26:18.020
You can't show up as your best self, as a leader, as an individual performer, if you're not, if you're not making sure that you're your own number one.

00:26:18.020 --> 00:26:26.750
And I say that as a mom too, and I, you know this is a you, as you can imagine, saying this as a mother, there's all kinds of it's a controversial thing to say.

00:26:26.750 --> 00:26:30.288
Like you know, you got to take care of yourself before you can take care of your, your kids.

00:26:30.367 --> 00:26:41.651
But I'll tell you you, there was a couple of years ago and again I'm very open I broke, I was broken in half and I, just when I was broken, I couldn't be there for my kids in the way that they needed me to be.

00:26:41.765 --> 00:26:48.952
And we just wanna help people not get to that point, whether it's working themselves to death or thinking they have to.

00:26:48.952 --> 00:26:57.573
They've been programmed to be this loyal sort of corporate soldier and, honestly, people get to a point where they're like wait a second.

00:26:57.573 --> 00:27:05.096
Sometimes it's unfortunate I mean a lot of times it's unfortunate because maybe they've been a part of a right sizing or downsizing.

00:27:05.096 --> 00:27:09.415
And then it's just helping people get back to that and saying, like, helping them build back up.

00:27:09.415 --> 00:27:12.874
Like you know what, you are good at your job, you, you are hard, you can do hard things.

00:27:12.874 --> 00:27:18.729
This was a shitty situation, but let us help you build yourself back up, because you got to this point.

00:27:18.729 --> 00:27:21.434
But this happened for you, not to you.

00:27:21.434 --> 00:27:30.450
And this is why it happened for you, because you're going to come out on this way better and more whole than where you were, you know, six months, a year ago, whatever the timing is.

00:27:31.231 --> 00:27:42.053
Yeah, I love the way that you articulate that, especially because that's something that we know those terrible feelings, but so often we can spiral into those feelings instead of the way out.

00:27:42.053 --> 00:27:47.193
Which I think that you illuminate so clearly with us is that it is a journey and you talk about coming out the other side of it.

00:27:47.193 --> 00:27:50.088
I also know from the enterprise level so many of them.

00:27:50.088 --> 00:27:51.270
They're obsessed with metrics.

00:27:51.270 --> 00:27:57.153
They want to know these results and I'm sure it's part of your sales processes when you show them hey, here's our value add, here's the.

00:27:57.153 --> 00:28:00.467
You know, a lot of industries want to know what's the ROI of this investment.

00:28:00.467 --> 00:28:05.657
How do you quantify that, whether it is quantitatively or qualitatively?

00:28:05.657 --> 00:28:11.166
I'd love to hear how you articulate that end result that people get by doing this type of work.

00:28:12.467 --> 00:28:13.467
Yeah, it's a little bit of both.

00:28:13.467 --> 00:28:39.092
I mean, what we talk about a lot of the times is like the qualitative you know the qualitative metric, because, again, our whole thing is like, if you invest at your biggest assets, your people right, like you have to invest in them, and especially when it comes to you know, we're doing a lot of work and right now, because of again, I hate to keep bringing up the downturn, but there's a lot of like survivor's guilt.

00:28:39.092 --> 00:29:08.096
I guess that goes on when you're you've lost some coworkers that you really respected, that you had friendships with, and so a lot of that is helping them come back from it and making sure that again, they're still putting in what they want to put in and find happiness in their work and find joy in their work, and but also establishing deeper connections with people that you work with to be able to do that.

00:29:08.096 --> 00:29:10.648
So that's a lot of the work that we do in the corporate training world.

00:29:10.648 --> 00:29:16.980
Right, it's like we get to a point where we are kind of scared.

00:29:17.382 --> 00:29:24.512
Right, you're kind of scared, you're like I don't feel safe, I don't know what's next, and it's really just about like you know what, we don't know what's next.

00:29:24.512 --> 00:29:27.041
No, I mean like change is the only constant right, but it's really just about like you know what, we don't know what's next.

00:29:27.041 --> 00:29:28.086
I mean like change is the only constant Right.

00:29:28.086 --> 00:29:34.542
But it's almost like you know, I use this Megan and I talk to each other in like a funny way, but sometimes I'll be like just slap me, just slap me.

00:29:34.542 --> 00:29:35.631
I got to like shake out of it.

00:29:35.631 --> 00:29:37.854
But it's kind of like that sort of thing Right, like it's.

00:29:37.854 --> 00:29:49.451
This happened, let's, let's give it a minute, because obviously it's, it's upsetting and it deserves for people to move through the things that have happened.

00:29:49.451 --> 00:29:58.694
But also, we're going to work to build off this and we almost tell everybody whether it's a group of people or whether it's individuals.

00:29:58.694 --> 00:30:03.997
We promise you you're going to be better off after this journey even though it's going to feel hard.

00:30:04.076 --> 00:30:06.031
It's going to feel hard, a lot of it's going to feel hard.

00:30:06.031 --> 00:30:27.020
And when I did it for the first time, when I went through my first coach I had and I don't mean to like scare people, but I was at a point in my life I was like, oh my gosh, like I just I couldn't figure out what was next or what I should do and I had so many breakthroughs but it was hard, I cried a lot you know like, and I'm going to say it I cried a lot Like it was.

00:30:27.040 --> 00:30:30.885
Just it was oh yeah, I am really freaking good at this.

00:30:30.885 --> 00:30:42.858
I just forgot because I had been beaten down, and so it's just helping people build back up when they've been beaten down, maybe for a little too long, and that could be self-inflicted or not, you know.

00:30:47.810 --> 00:30:49.538
Yeah, jackie, I really appreciate your transparency in all of these things.

00:30:49.538 --> 00:30:50.986
It's a promise that you made to us at the top of today's episode.

00:30:50.986 --> 00:30:51.669
You've certainly delivered on it.

00:30:51.669 --> 00:30:54.698
But I also want to say I can't have you on and not talk to you.

00:30:54.698 --> 00:31:03.615
I love, towards the end of these conversations, transitioning to talking entrepreneur to entrepreneur, not just as a subject matter expert, but I always remind listeners you are also one of us.

00:31:03.615 --> 00:31:10.288
You are not only servicing your clients through all these things, but you're also running a business while being a mom as well.

00:31:10.288 --> 00:31:11.671
So I think it's incredible what you do.

00:31:11.671 --> 00:31:14.038
So what are some of those Jackie hacks?

00:31:14.038 --> 00:31:17.476
What are some of the things that have really optimized, cause you've been at this for a while?

00:31:17.476 --> 00:31:23.174
What have you found that works for you to help you optimize your ability to perform as an entrepreneur as well?

00:31:23.194 --> 00:31:36.961
I think it's a we talk a lot about this, but as an entrepreneur as well, I think it's we talk a lot about this, but as an entrepreneur and of course in the enterprise space, we do a lot of work in general all over, but you do have to be dialed into a certain extent.

00:31:36.961 --> 00:31:49.380
In the business day right, or in the work day, the one thing that we've done is there are times where I do wanna go pick up my kids and do something with them in the afternoon, and then that means that I'm working at night.

00:31:49.380 --> 00:32:00.773
And I think, like as entrepreneurs, it's like, oh man, I'm working all the time and you do get to the point where like, oh, I need, I need a day, like I need a mental health day and you need to make sure that you're checking yourself on occasion.

00:32:00.773 --> 00:32:10.494
But it's also just like allowing yourself to have those moments of joy and kind of like again deprogram what you thought should be the workday from like nine to six.

00:32:10.494 --> 00:32:14.315
Like as entrepreneurs, right, like we just get the work done, regardless of when it gets done.

00:32:14.836 --> 00:32:21.922
And I think there's like a beauty to that right, because it's just about getting it done but also being able to do the other things that bring you joy.

00:32:21.922 --> 00:32:41.402
And you know, I told this to a client recently that had just gotten laid off and he was pretty down and I said that you know, and I come from my mom's half Greek and we have a lot of European family and you know what they say, and this is again going back to the identity question.

00:32:41.402 --> 00:32:46.939
But people a lot of times in Europe will be like what do you, what do you, you like to do?

00:32:46.939 --> 00:33:00.011
Well, here in the, in the States, typically they say what do you do Right, meaning like what do you do for work, so again it goes back to identity and like your work does not define you completely as a person.

00:33:00.032 --> 00:33:05.942
And that still goes for entrepreneurship, right, like we're entrepreneurs but also there's so many other things that make up us.

00:33:05.942 --> 00:33:12.791
And so allowing yourself to enjoy those moments and not stress out about them and like also just failing.

00:33:12.791 --> 00:33:17.222
You know, many times as entrepreneurs, I talk about all the times I fail, like I fail daily.

00:33:17.222 --> 00:33:23.792
I mean I think we all do and it's just having a safe space to talk about it and turning it around saying like you know what you don't?

00:33:23.894 --> 00:33:25.049
grow from succeeding.

00:33:25.049 --> 00:33:26.272
You grow from failing.

00:33:26.272 --> 00:33:29.722
So let's just talk about it so we can learn from each other.

00:33:29.722 --> 00:33:36.755
And just, I don't know, shoot the shit, because we all have to vent sometimes, Whether you're an entrepreneur or not.

00:33:36.755 --> 00:33:38.079
It can be hard out there.

00:33:38.079 --> 00:33:39.095
The world is hard right now.

00:33:39.095 --> 00:33:45.363
So it's just being very true to yourself and being authentic and just stop filtering yourself.

00:33:45.363 --> 00:33:47.557
Right, Even we talk about.

00:33:47.557 --> 00:33:49.796
I tell Megan, I was like don't put a filter on me.

00:33:49.796 --> 00:33:58.933
It's like you know, if I've, if I've got a blemish, if I've got a bad hair day, if I don't look good like they should see it, we're not all perfect, we're not supposed to be, so it's just allowing that.

00:34:00.016 --> 00:34:01.377
Yes, amen to that.

00:34:01.377 --> 00:34:09.474
And you know what, jackie, as I'm half Albanian, so we are neighbors, so I love the advice that you are bringing from Greeks to Albanian culture.

00:34:09.474 --> 00:34:10.117
It is something.

00:34:10.117 --> 00:34:14.818
It's something that's so out there is that this has become.

00:34:14.818 --> 00:34:16.184
You talk about the programming again.

00:34:16.184 --> 00:34:26.882
Here in the United States we have been programming to have certain work thoughts, but I think this is the real stuff and, as a chronic night owl, what you're calling out about just get the work done.

00:34:27.289 --> 00:34:34.632
I've long shed those expectations of society on the way that I'm supposed to, the way that you talk about deprogramming.

00:34:34.632 --> 00:34:36.478
I throw so much shade on supposed to.

00:34:36.478 --> 00:34:38.592
I don't like I'm supposed to do anything.

00:34:38.592 --> 00:34:40.275
I am also rebellious by nature.

00:34:40.275 --> 00:34:47.539
I'll always do it my own way and I think that you're such a shiny example of how we can all do that we don't need permission from others.

00:34:47.539 --> 00:34:56.172
And, jackie, you've been such a real life example of that here in today's episode, which I have no idea how you're going to answer this last question, because we covered so much good stuff here today.

00:34:56.172 --> 00:34:57.838
But what's the takeaway?

00:34:57.838 --> 00:35:00.891
What's that one piece of advice that you want to leave every listener with?

00:35:00.891 --> 00:35:04.338
They've heard all of these incredible topics that we've dove into today.

00:35:04.338 --> 00:35:05.460
But what's that?

00:35:05.460 --> 00:35:08.523
One thing that you hope everyone who listened to Jackie today says.

00:35:08.523 --> 00:35:11.681
You know what I'm finally going to think about this or do this.

00:35:13.268 --> 00:35:20.777
Uh yeah, I think that it goes back to what we end with with all of our, a lot of our clients, whether it's a in group settings or not.

00:35:20.777 --> 00:35:22.615
It's just like don't be afraid to be yourself.

00:35:22.615 --> 00:35:25.699
There's only one you out there and it's pretty frigging awesome.

00:35:25.699 --> 00:35:35.851
So just like show that version, stop whatever version that you thought you're supposed to show up with in life, whether it's you know stuff you learned from childhood or you know whatever got you to this point.

00:35:35.851 --> 00:35:42.775
Like I bet that real person is pretty awesome and I think people would like it if you just allowed for that person to come through.

00:35:43.478 --> 00:35:45.141
Yes, I love that advice.

00:35:45.141 --> 00:35:51.940
Listeners, that applies to every single one of you, even though Jackie has not had the chance to meet every single one of you.

00:35:51.940 --> 00:35:56.197
This is a universal truth that everyone has that awesome inside of them.

00:35:56.197 --> 00:35:57.501
Let that show.

00:35:57.501 --> 00:35:59.152
Let it show in the way you live life.

00:35:59.152 --> 00:36:03.934
Let it show in the way you do business, in your marketing, your sales, your website, literally everything which.

00:36:03.934 --> 00:36:09.797
Speaking of that, jackie, I love the way that you and Megan show up in all the things that you both do business-wise.

00:36:09.797 --> 00:36:12.635
It's prevalent Anywhere that people find your business.

00:36:12.635 --> 00:36:16.615
They're gonna find you and Megan being yourself, so drop those links on us.

00:36:16.615 --> 00:36:18.416
Where should listeners go from here?

00:36:19.769 --> 00:36:24.021
Yeah, so we have our website, peopleconduitcom.

00:36:24.021 --> 00:36:27.231
We also have our Instagram and then you can find us on LinkedIn too.

00:36:27.231 --> 00:36:36.858
But yeah, would love to connect with anybody that took away anything or just wants to chat more, because that's what really gets us going in the morning.

00:36:36.898 --> 00:36:58.340
We love to talk to people right, and meet new people and basically find like-minded people going through the same stuff that we can all lean on each other for yes, listeners, you not only heard it from Jackie here today, but you saw it in action how much she injects herself in that willingness to have more communication, more dialogue, more vulnerability.

00:36:58.340 --> 00:37:00.572
It's so much the theme of today's conversation.

00:37:00.572 --> 00:37:03.059
So, listeners, find those links down below.

00:37:03.059 --> 00:37:05.193
Wherever it is that you're tuning into today's episode.

00:37:05.193 --> 00:37:11.835
You can click right on through to Jackie's business website at peopleconduitcom, as well as the LinkedIn links, social media links.

00:37:11.835 --> 00:37:14.692
Don't be shy, you'll find all of those links down below.

00:37:14.813 --> 00:37:40.344
Jackie, on behalf of myself and all of our listeners worldwide, thanks so much for joining us on the show today.

00:37:40.344 --> 00:37:40.885
Yeah, this is great.

00:37:40.885 --> 00:37:41.766
Thank you so much for having me.

00:37:41.766 --> 00:37:42.786
Amazing guests.

00:37:42.786 --> 00:37:51.559
There's a reason why we are ad free and have produced so many incredible episodes five days a week for you, and it's because our guests step up to the plate.

00:37:51.559 --> 00:37:53.612
These are not sponsored episodes.

00:37:53.612 --> 00:37:55.217
These are not infomercials.

00:37:55.217 --> 00:37:58.690
Our guests help us cover the costs of our productions.

00:37:58.690 --> 00:38:09.643
They so deeply believe in the power of getting their message out in front of you, awesome entrepreneurs and entrepreneurs, that they contribute to help us make these productions possible.

00:38:09.643 --> 00:38:18.141
So thank you to not only today's guests, but all of our guests in general, and I just want to invite you check out our website because you can send us a voicemail there.

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We also have live chat.

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If you want to interact directly with me, go to thewantrepreneurshowcom.

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Initiate a live chat.

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It's for real me and I'm excited because I'll see you, as always every Monday, wednesday, friday, saturday and Sunday here on the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.