949: MEMES, AI, and the 3xMatrix to grow FAST w/ Jennie Wu

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Hey, what is up?

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Welcome to this episode of the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.

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As always, I'm your host, brian LoFermento, and I have got an awesome guest here today who is doing really innovative and very cool things within the world of marketing.

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And you all know I'm super biased about marketing, because marketing is the growth fuel for all of our businesses, and today's guest has done incredible things on a global level.

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You're going to see that her reach not only is rooted in the experiences across the globe in different markets, different economies, serving different groups of people, but also in the varied ways that she believes that marketing can be done to reach even more people and serve even more people.

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So let me tell you about today's guest.

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Her name is Jenny Wu.

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Jenny graduated from Columbia University in New York and she was also previously a product manager in China, where she developed a smart payment product that achieved daily revenues of $1.2 million starting from scratch.

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This product reached users from developed cities all the way to impoverished mountainous regions in China.

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The inclusive and highly accessible user mindset has deeply influenced Jenny's business approach, applying the logic of user experience to company operations.

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Her current company, after just one year, has been recognized as one of the fastest growing marketing companies.

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Speaking of her marketing company, it's called Hash Matrix.

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It's a full stack growth marketing agency that's doing a lot of cool things.

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They are empowering over 50 AI startups, catalyzing their marketing strategies and expanding their audience reach across the United States.

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They're also doing some really cool things on a tech front.

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I'm going to let Jenny tell you about all of that, so I'm not going to say anything else.

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Let's dive straight into my interview with Jenny Wu.

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All right, jenny, I'm so excited that you're here with us today.

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First things first.

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Welcome to the show.

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Thanks for having me.

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Heck.

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Yes, I love talking about all things marketing and you clearly love marketing as well, in so many different ways.

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But before you and I get to geek out about marketing, take us beyond the bio.

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Who's jenny?

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How did you start doing all these amazing things from china here to the united states?

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yeah, uh.

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So for me, my story is I think it's a very like curve, because in China I'm a product manager and I found like it's very um.

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It's very difficult for me to uh how to say sorry, it's um it because it's um.

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I want to.

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I want to pursue a life uh who which can resonate different people and talk with different people.

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So I quit my job and come to the US.

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I applied at Columbia University, which is the start point of my business.

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So when I first arrived in the US, I feel like it was really hard to break into the core market because of the language and cultural differences.

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It was like I could only paste together my understanding of the core market because of the language and cultural differences.

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It was like I could only piece together my understanding of the mainstream market from bits and pieces of information and that makes my startup business really tough and even almost.

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There was a time I feel like an outsider.

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But during the rapid rise of artificial intelligence, I observed that many teams with strong technical backgrounds and innovative product ideas they struggled with marketing.

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I think this is because I know both the how to build a product and also I know the marketing skills, so I can bring the different skills together.

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So that's the start point to start my marketing company.

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Yeah, I love that overview, Jenny, especially because it's something that I learned really on is that even if you have a great idea and a great product, it does not matter if you don't have great marketing.

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There's probably some incredible AI tools out there that we've never heard of because they're not great at the marketing aspect.

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Talk to us about where your approach to marketing, because obviously you've also recognized that as the growth engine for businesses and technologies and solutions.

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Where did that marketing background come from?

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me because during my past experience as the product manager, I do product design and also I do a lot of marketing research because I need to know how my audience understand my product, from the initial to a very complete version.

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That's given my experience in the marketing understanding.

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Also, before I start Hatchmetrics, I do tech startup and I do some fundraising with different ventures.

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During this experience I get a lot of know-how on how to do some go-to-market uh solutions.

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Yeah, yeah, I love that because go-to-market is really important, because that is establishing a brand new brand and, jenny, it's right there in your bio.

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I talked about how you built a smart payment product that achieved daily revenues of over a million dollars from scratch.

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Talk to us about that nature because it's something obviously our listeners love it.

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The Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast we love new beginnings.

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We love people who take something brand new to the world and bring it to actually help people.

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Talk to us about what makes go-to-market different.

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Why do we have that term in the world of marketing, of go-to-market?

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What's so important about that phase?

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Okay, it's a payment terminal and we do that because of uh, we in that period, like five years ago, we, uh, we realized that there is a um, there is a shift in china from the uh, from use cash to use like electronic payment, like, for example, people use Apple pay or also use Alipay to do the transaction.

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So we think that maybe we should a terminal for all kind of business, all kind of business and the restaurant or even some small food carts to collect the money very efficiently.

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So that's the ideal.

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And then, because in that period I work in a really big company, so we gain our audience.

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Almost we don't have any difficulties to gain our audience because we have a lot of traffic from different other products in our company.

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So we have a very good starting point and then we regularize this market, then we build this product.

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Yeah, it's really lucky.

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Yeah, I love that lucky.

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Yeah, yeah, I love that you call it lucky, jenny, but I'm not going to call it lucky because obviously so much goes into a successful marketing strategy and getting it out to people, especially in China, is a huge market with so much diversity in the customer base.

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Talk to us about the different tools that you can use within your marketing toolkit, because I see it when I love the way that you've built hash matrix and your website and it's so clear we use that term full stack marketing and you offer public relations, content marketing, search engine optimization.

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Talk to us about the different service lines and different ways that companies can use these different components of marketing to actually grow their user base their user base.

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Okay.

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So for me, because of my previous experience, I think understanding your audience is really important and based on that you should build your product deeply associated with it.

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Okay, also, take my the payment product as example, because in China a lot of people they even don't go to the high school, so many people have the different understanding of electronic product.

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So how to make it very accessible for massive people, especially if we do the payment terminal for some small restaurant, you need to deal with many people.

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They don't know how to use very high-end technology.

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So we designed the user interface really simple.

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It's just like a calculator, because even the the most ordinary or people know how to use CACinator, so we designed a really simple interface.

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So from that experience I realized that if you want to do some go-to-marketing strategy very efficiently, you should do some research on your audience, and this research is not based on the paperwork, but you should also talk to your audience again and again and know what they usually do, what's their habit and how they thought.

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Yeah, that's a key point, yeah.

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I like that.

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I want to go a little bit deeper there, because I remember one of my favorite Henry Ford quotes where he says if I asked my customers what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse.

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And obviously instead he invented the car and brought the car to the marketplace, and that forever changed the world.

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And so, jenny, I want to get inside your head.

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What types of questions do you ask your customers?

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Because you as a marketer, you as a strategist, you obviously are able to take that customer feedback and their stories and apply it to real life marketing strategies and campaigns, and you even talk about it influences the user interface, it influences the design of the product.

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What types of questions do you ask these people in these conversations?

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yeah for that question.

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Uh, we generally don't ask people, whether you like it or you don't like it, we don't.

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We don't ask people about when, uh, about some question that they can only answer by a word, because people may not tell the truth, even they don't know they would, whether they tell the truth, because they may don't understanding, uh, your question or even themselves.

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So we ask question you already.

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Um, we really uh require the customer to answer a question through a description of the habits, of how they thought.

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It's mainly several sentences instead of just one word, and also for user research purpose.

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Basically, we will ask three different questions, but these three different questions they direct to the same direction and if the audience or if the users they answered two of three questions with one preference or one direction, they maybe tell the truth.

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So by that way we can understand our audience or users better.

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Yeah, I like that, especially because that's super actionable.

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We can all implement that in our businesses.

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Listeners, you hear how Jenny is talking about how all of these things influence these decisions, and it's something that we hear from so many guests that they echo it is that you have to understand your customers.

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So, jenny, seeing this real life feedback from you is really valuable for all of our listeners.

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I wanna transition a little bit and actually talk about marketing channels and strategies, because on your website even I mean you obviously love content.

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We appreciate you coming on here.

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Obviously, podcasts are the home of a lot of content.

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One thing that you also offer at Hash Matrix influencer marketing.

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You've achieved over 8 million views for your clients.

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Obviously, that sort of reach helps you to bring products in front of new audiences.

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Talk to us about the role of content in a marketing mix, whether it's creating content or influencer marketing.

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How has the game changed?

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How are companies using content to get their stuff out there more?

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yeah, I like this question.

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Yeah, because I like content marketing, because I think nowadays content marketing become really important because people have different ideas, people, different people, have different understanding from multiple perspective even for just one product.

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So how can we present a product from a different perspective to attract our different audience?

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That's made me recognize, like a recent year I think it's from my understanding that recent year I found the memes in the image.

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They're really efficient in creating sound content and I also pick one of our clients, rabbit R1, which is the AI device, and we create many memes to acquire a lot of audience.

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And also we encourage the audience to create memes because in the past I think people create content very.

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People may create very like dedicated advisement or dedicated like movies for to promote their product.

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That is a really good way, but it cannot resonate people.

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But now I think that many, because of the rise of social media recent years, especially on TikTok and Instagram, people may need a new way to express themselves.

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I think one of my observations is that memes become very important recently because it has.

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For me, I think it has three reasons.

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The first one is it goes viral very quickly because it's often spread rapidly across different social media platforms, making them a powerful tool for reaching large audience quickly.

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And also it's really low production cost.

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Everybody can create it.

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It can engage people with the brand very deeply Instead of only passively receive the information.

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The audience or your user can interact with you to create some very funny pictures and also, I think, it can build empathy.

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So that's why I always encourage our clients to do some very high engagement activities, like to ask the audience to create memes, because for me, I think um like, because people at all like after all, all, most of our, most of us like are not superstars, so we have a very normal daily life and we have many difficulties to deal with.

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We have many things that are unhappy, that happen every day.

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So that way can make the audience, make the users create, build the empathy, make the users create, build the empathy.

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So I think that's become a very efficient content way to promote the product.

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That is one thing, and the second observation for me is that I think the influencer marketing has become very more and more important.

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Even they are more efficient than some superstar and a singer because those influencers, they can attract a very diverse audience.

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So we also do influencer marketing, um, like youtube and uh tiktok and instagram.

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Yeah, I don't know whether I, maybe I might.

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My answer is a little bit uh sorry no, jenny, I think it's perfect because I will tell you that in 949 episodes, you're the first guest ever to talk about the importance of memes.

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But as a millennial, for example, I can speak for myself is that so much of our generation we love entertainment and you talk about a lot of companies think they need to have the very polished, very produced content, but the truth is a lot of especially the younger audiences we love entertainment, we love funny things, we love scrolling through the social media platforms and seeing things that we want to share with our friends.

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So, yeah, I love that advice and those insights it leads me to, because clearly, you light up when we talk about content marketing and I know that part of what makes Hash Matrix different is the 3X matrix.

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Talk to us about the 3x Matrix and before I actually before I ask you about that, I want to make this disclaimer because so many listeners we always hear that phrase content is king.

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It's something we say a lot in the world of marketing.

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But creating that content, distributing that content there's so many platforms today.

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There's so many different ways for us to do that.

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Talk to us about the 3x Matrix and how that service has really shaped the way that you deliver and create that content with your clients.

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Okay for 3x Matrix.

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There are many three purposes that we want to achieve through this 3x Matrix.

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First of all, 3x Matrix is an all-in-one solution for video content and the first thing we want to achieve is video search result optimization on social media, for example, nowadays, if you search a keyword in the past people may search that keyword on amazon or on google, but I will believe that in the future, more and more people will search keywords until from the, from the products they like on tick tock, instagram or youtube, because they want to get understanding from very funny entertainment videos instead of advertisement or just details of our product.

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So the first thing we want to achieve is that we want to optimize the video search result Because for 3x metrics we mainly do video production and distribution.

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We can generate and product thousands of videos for our clients and also distribute those videos on social media.

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So that way, because we get different hashtags and titles for each video, so people may search keywords and can target associate videos and then our client's product or our client's video got promoted or our client's video got promoted.

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So I think that is a new way for promoting a product or promoting a brand in the future.

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And the second thing is from this way we do content accumulation, because for most audiences they make a decision from receiving information on social media to complete a transaction is a complete causal chain.

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So many companies they may spend a lot of money on like, promote this product through advertisement but they ignore the importance of content marketing.

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So through this way, like the distribution and the production, we can create a lot of very interesting and very valuable content on social media which can evolve into branding impact over time, which can evolve into branding impact over time.

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And the third reason is we also, through 3X metrics, we can provide content directions because many brands currently they don't know what direction to take with the videos on social media, even though the same product can be explained from multiple dimensions.

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For example, one of our clients they sell the dresses for a young woman in the US, the name is Cider they can highlight both cost effectiveness and the style.

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So through our content analysis and we found that in the past quarter when we do some content that promotes affordable perspective, the result in the video can attract higher conversion rates.

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So therefore we can provide this insight and these directions for our clients and so they can not only produce this kind of content, but also they can even modify the business line or the produce line for the whole company.

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Yeah, yeah, jenny, I love that overview, especially because you all lay it out so clearly and it really challenges all of us to have more content, to put more content out there so that people can actually find us.

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And with regards to the types of companies that you all like working with at Hash Matrix, you've already mentioned a few of them here on the air and I think it's becoming household names.

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More and more people are familiar with Rabbit, for example.

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I'm going to call them out because the AI space is moving so fast, technology is moving so fast.

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What is it about the world of AI?

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What's the direction you see it going in?

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Because a lot of us use ChatGPT, but Rabbit, I think, is very cool because that's a physical product that people can actually hold.

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I think it's doing really cool things in that space.

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From your perspective, as someone who's seen really inside the world of fast moving, rapidly growing AI companies and tech companies, what's the direction that you see AI moving in?

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For me, I think AI is not an end product, it's not a result.

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It's a solution or it's a system for you to achieve your goal.

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If you do some medical care industry with AI, you can make it more efficient, make it more user-friendly for your audience, and if you do entertainment industry, you can make it more fantastic.

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So for me, I don't.

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I don't think some I don't think AI is a product or is a result, and I think I think it's a, it's a system.

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Yeah, it can facilitate the different interesting product in different industry.

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And for Rabbit R1, it is one of our hardware device clients and I think because nowadays many people have different opinions about it, but I still think it's quite interesting because it makes Last year.

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When everybody talks about chat, gpt or AI software, it is one of the first companies who want to do it as a hardware device.

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I think that's a meaningful attempt to present a product then a product to show nowadays people how AI can be in the future.

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Maybe it's not very perfect, but it can provide some insight, for no matter the ordinary people or the founders or other technical companies, they can provide many insights.

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Yeah, that's my opinion.

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Yeah, yeah, jenny, I really appreciate those insights, especially because I think something that you called out is very important in that the first iteration.

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You're talking about a new hardware device.

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It is difficult to get that market penetration.

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We saw it.

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I still remember when the iPhone was announced.

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A lot of us had iPods.

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Back then the rest of us had flip phones and people said who needs their phone to browse the internet?

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Who needs their phone to have all of these apps?

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And people thought it was a crazy idea that Steve Jobs brought to the world.

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But now we see it's ubiquitous.

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And today I mean I've got an Apple Watch on right now.

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People thought who needs their notifications on their watch?

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Apple continues to do it with the Apple Vision Pro.

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There's so many different hardware solutions that are embedding really cool technology, really cool software, into our physical lives.

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But of course, it is a process.

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So, speaking of all of these different tools, you and I are talking about some hardware solutions.

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Listeners always ask us about different tools and, jenny, you work in the world of tech.

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You also work in the world of marketing.

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What are some of your favorite tools for businesses?

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There's a lot of content creation tools.

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There's a lot of AI tools that are assistants, like you mentioned there.

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What are some of your favorite tools to use as a business owner right now?

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For me.

00:26:08.415 --> 00:27:08.003
So for some professional tools for no matter companies, founders, for example, for some professional tools, I usually use Brand24, which, from this product, you can monitor different brands, what they happened during the last several months, which influencers they collaborated with and you can put in your website and you can compare your competitors from very deep understanding perspective, because you can know, you can see the exact traffic, where the exact traffic come from, from Google, from Instagram, from YouTube.

00:27:08.003 --> 00:27:12.990
You can know very deeply about your product and your competitor's product.

00:27:12.990 --> 00:27:28.065
So, and for my everyday use, I still love ChatGPT because it's quite easy to use and to organize my thoughts, and also I use Miro to collaborate with my team.

00:27:28.065 --> 00:27:28.486
Member.

00:27:28.506 --> 00:27:32.561
Yeah, yeah, I love it, go ahead.

00:27:32.602 --> 00:27:41.987
Go ahead, jenny, if there's more okay and uh, I one of our clients product I really like is named monicaim.

00:27:41.987 --> 00:27:44.009
It's a ai assistant.

00:27:44.009 --> 00:28:02.188
It can like invade in your chrome, uh, to help you organize the information, because nowadays the Chrome they do many sponsorship and makes your searching result not very accurate.

00:28:02.188 --> 00:28:12.535
But with Molucarim you can know you can and the search result is exactly what you want without the sponsorship.

00:28:12.836 --> 00:28:15.000
Yeah yeah, really cool tools.

00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:15.362
Jenny.

00:28:15.362 --> 00:28:17.948
I asked this question very frequently here on this show.

00:28:17.948 --> 00:28:23.922
You introduced us to some brand new tools, so listeners definitely go back and check out those tools that jenny mentioned.

00:28:23.922 --> 00:28:29.909
And it's really cool that it's actually a company that you're working on and you're helping them grow, so I love those real life examples.

00:28:30.290 --> 00:28:31.776
I want to transition a little bit, jenny.

00:28:31.776 --> 00:28:42.720
I love at the end of these conversations, to talk entrepreneur to entrepreneur, not just as a marketing expert, not just as someone who's great at AI and within the tech space, but also someone who's growing your own business.

00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:46.016
What are some of the things that have been eye-opening for you?

00:28:46.016 --> 00:28:48.319
What are some of the things that have surprised you?

00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:52.930
Obviously, there's been a bit of a culture shock moving from China to the United States.

00:28:52.930 --> 00:28:55.074
You recently relocated to Los Angeles.

00:28:55.074 --> 00:28:59.083
I'm so excited for you to switch coasts and experience the West Coast lifestyle.

00:28:59.083 --> 00:29:04.044
What are some of those things as a business owner that have made you say, wow, I didn't expect this.

00:29:04.044 --> 00:29:07.098
And maybe some things that you really enjoy about being an entrepreneur.

00:29:08.340 --> 00:29:22.009
Yeah, I really love being an entrepreneur because I always like, uh, talk to different people and to explore a new industry from the just I say from an outsider to a insider.

00:29:22.009 --> 00:29:44.768
This process very interesting for me and I I want to say that if you want to be an entrepreneur, if you want to explore your business not just doing some boring work you don't like you need to believe yourself.

00:29:44.768 --> 00:30:06.865
Because I remember when I was in Columbia University, my professor, she told me that instead of complaining about why I don't have this, why I don't have that, we should probably think of what we already have and take advantage of it.

00:30:06.865 --> 00:30:11.647
So that's really encouraged me to pursue my business.

00:30:12.148 --> 00:30:16.768
Yeah, yeah, jenny, I love that and I always ask this question at the end of every episode.

00:30:16.768 --> 00:30:18.536
You've given us so much good advice today.

00:30:18.536 --> 00:30:23.175
I don't know how you're going to add on to that, but you get to answer this in any way you want.

00:30:23.175 --> 00:30:28.796
What's your one piece of advice for people at all different stages of their entrepreneurial journey?

00:30:28.796 --> 00:30:31.962
Some of them have businesses that are already doing a lot of revenue.

00:30:31.962 --> 00:30:38.083
Some of them are just starting out and they may be, like you were at Columbia, wondering can I do this, should I do this?

00:30:38.083 --> 00:30:42.440
What's that one piece of advice that you want everyone to take away from today's episode?

00:30:44.523 --> 00:30:45.747
Yeah, I love the question.

00:30:46.407 --> 00:31:12.394
For me, I think, first of all, you should do some business that's associated with, at least associated with one part of your experience, even though it's a completely new job or new direction, but you should have the ability to bridge the experience with your previous experience.

00:31:12.473 --> 00:31:23.358
That is very important because you, first of all, you need to become a professional people with a deeper understanding if you want to start your business.

00:31:23.358 --> 00:31:38.301
And also, I think that people from different stage I think that people from different stage, they can become an entrepreneur.

00:31:38.301 --> 00:32:10.144
Sorry, I should repeat this, because for me, I think there are not still a lot of opportunities everywhere, but for me, I think you should recognize whether it's a one of opportunities or it's sustainable, because for one of opportunity, you can earn money or you can become a partner advisor or you can become your partner job.

00:32:10.144 --> 00:32:18.907
But if your rate of rise is sustainable and it has mutually beneficial opportunities, it can create business.

00:32:18.907 --> 00:32:32.188
So that's why I create my business, because I realized that the rise of AI will become and will continue to become a trend in the flowing years.

00:32:32.667 --> 00:32:35.375
Yeah, yeah, really cool insights, jenny.

00:32:35.375 --> 00:32:39.961
I love the fact that not only do you give that advice to all of our listeners, but you followed it yourself.

00:32:39.961 --> 00:32:43.056
I think you're such a good example of all these things we talked about today.

00:32:43.056 --> 00:32:57.560
And, speaking of that, listeners, jenny and I covered many things about marketing and full stack marketing, from start to finish, the different marketing tools that jenny and hash matrix have in their portfolio, and all of those things are laid out so beautifully on their website.

00:32:57.560 --> 00:32:58.886
Definitely check it out.

00:32:58.886 --> 00:33:08.778
So, jenny, for listeners who want to go deeper into discovering all the cool things that you're doing with hash matrix and how you're part of the tech and the ai revolution, drop those on us.

00:33:08.778 --> 00:33:10.578
Where should listeners go from here?

00:33:11.640 --> 00:33:19.007
You can find us on hashmatrixxyz, which is our official website, and you can also find me on LinkedIn.

00:33:19.007 --> 00:33:22.289
My name is Jenny Wu and nice to meet you.

00:33:23.090 --> 00:33:25.011
Yes, listeners, you already know the drill.

00:33:25.011 --> 00:33:27.541
We are making it as easy as possible for you to find those links.

00:33:27.541 --> 00:33:34.097
Jenny's website for Hashmatrix is at hashmatrixxyz, as well as a link to her personal LinkedIn.

00:33:34.097 --> 00:33:40.425
No matter where it is that you're tuning into today's episode, Just scroll right on down and you can click through to her website or connect with her on LinkedIn.

00:33:40.425 --> 00:33:46.236
Otherwise, Jenny, on behalf of myself and all the listeners worldwide, thanks so much for coming on the show today.

00:33:47.378 --> 00:33:49.624
Thanks, I'm really happy to come here.

00:33:50.988 --> 00:33:56.586
Hey's brian here, and thanks for tuning in to yet another episode of the wantrepreneur to entrepreneur podcast.

00:33:56.586 --> 00:34:07.310
If you haven't checked us out online, there's so much good stuff there check out the show's website and all the show notes that we talked about in today's episode at thewantrepreneurshowcom.

00:34:07.310 --> 00:34:09.777
And I just want to give a shout out to our amazing guests.

00:34:09.777 --> 00:34:18.543
There's a reason why we are ad free and have produced so many incredible episodes five days a week for you, and it's because our guests step up to the plate.

00:34:18.543 --> 00:34:20.603
These are not sponsored episodes.

00:34:20.603 --> 00:34:22.181
These are not infomercials.

00:34:22.355 --> 00:34:25.574
Our guests help us cover the costs of our productions.

00:34:25.574 --> 00:34:36.652
They so deeply believe in the power of getting their message out in front of you, awesome entrepreneurs and entrepreneurs, that they contribute to help us make these productions, deeply believe in the power of getting their message out in front of you, awesome entrepreneurs and entrepreneurs, that they contribute to help us make these productions possible.

00:34:36.652 --> 00:34:45.143
So thank you to not only today's guests but all of our guests in general, and I just want to invite you check out our website because you can send us a voicemail there.

00:34:45.143 --> 00:34:46.485
We also have live chat.

00:34:46.485 --> 00:34:51.105
If you want to interact directly with me, go to thewantrepreneurshowcom.

00:34:51.105 --> 00:34:52.507
Initiate a live chat.

00:34:52.507 --> 00:35:01.923
It's for real me, and I'm excited because I'll see you as always every Monday, wednesday, friday, saturday and Sunday here on the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.