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Hey, what is up?
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Welcome to this episode of the Wantrepreneur to Entrepreneur podcast.
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As always, I'm your host, Brian Lofermento, and I'll tell you what.
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As a podcaster, I am so excited about today's guest and his skills and what he brings to other people, because this is an important consideration for any of us when it comes to hosting events, setting up spaces, connecting with people so that they can actually see us and hear us correctly.
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We live in a digital world where we are creating digital experiences all the time.
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Even if we're doing in-person events, audio and visual is going to touch upon the experience that you deliver, and today's guest not only is supremely talented when it comes to all things audiovisual, but this is someone who has also grown an incredible business that serves people on a commercial level as well as on a residential level.
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So let me tell you all about him.
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His name is Justin Powell.
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Justin is a CEO and founder.
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He boasts more than two decades of experience in sound engineering, complemented by a decade of hands-on experience in live production in audiovisual installations.
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Having collaborated with various organizations across Southern California, Justin has earned a reputation for crafting user-friendly and intuitive systems that deliver exceptional results.
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Those are not always words that we use.
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When it comes to audiovisual stuff, Justin believes in simplifying the audiovisual experience without compromising quality.
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Whether you require a comprehensive design for a 1,000-seat outdoor amphitheater or the installation of a compact residential system, Justin and his company offer solutions at a competitive price that outshines major online retailers.
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So if you've been looking to take your audio and visual game a bit more seriously, then Justin's going to give us some insights there, as well as talking about all the cool things that he's done to grow his own business and have such an incredible reputation in the industry.
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So we're all going to learn a lot from him today.
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I'm excited about this one.
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I'm not going to say anything else.
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Let's dive straight into my interview with Justin Powell.
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All right, Justin, I am so very excited that you're here with us.
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First things first.
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Welcome to the show.
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Thank you very much.
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Thanks for having me.
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Heck.
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Yes, I am excited to hear your backstory.
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I admire people in your space so much because I know how difficult that work is.
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So, first things first, justin, take us beyond the bio.
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Who's Justin?
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How'd you start doing all these cool things?
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Yeah.
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So I mean you mentioned how I've been in audio for 20 years.
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I really started as a musician back in high school.
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I just like music and I wanted to play music and from there I was like, oh, maybe I could record music as a as a career, and so I went to this certificate program at a local college and got a recording arts certificate from there, went into music production and the music industry is just so hard.
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I actually did pretty well, but it was so up and down and just not really a steady income and at the same time all this audio visual stuff was kind of merging with IT, because all the audio is now networked, all these systems need to work with computer systems and IT systems and I was like, wow, I have this like special set of skills now with audio and the IT side.
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So I mean, it naturally led me to what I'm doing now, which is, you know, audio visual integration.
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Yeah, I love that overview.
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Justin, I'll be honest with you.
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You and I talked a little bit off the air about the fact that you live in Southern California.
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I lived in Los Angeles for a while.
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Living in Southern California, you can't help but see these big productions happen In LA.
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I always see the guys who are setting up audio and visual production equipment in less than an ideal environment.
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Anytime I was in Santa Monica or on the setting up audio and visual production equipment in less than an ideal environment, Anytime I was in Santa Monica or on the Venice bike path, I thought to myself there's so much wind, there's so many people, there's birds flying everywhere.
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How the heck are you going to capture good audio and visual stuff?
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And then that's in complex environments.
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But what I'm even surprised about is, even in simple environments, most people get this stuff wrong.
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Even when we talk about a Zoom or a podcast anywhere, people are struggling when it comes to audio visual.
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How do you start getting this stuff right?
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Because it is a factor of not just the equipment that we have, but understanding the environment that we're operating in.
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Yeah, there's so many layers to it, but a big one, I think, is audio.
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And I think a lot of times people, they might get a good shot or the video might look good, but the audio might just be terrible.
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You know, because and and it just comes from lack of experience and people thinking, oh, I just throw up a mic and it'll sound good, but there's so many layers and factors that go into it because, uh, like you, like you mentioned, the space that you're in it causes reflections.
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You know you got to account for that and you got to be able to tune the room, you got to be able to use the right mics.
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It just it really comes down to experience and having done it and just learning the tricks.
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And you know that's why there's businesses like what we do, because it's so hard, like there's no way that I can even know everything.
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Like, I definitely do not know everything.
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I'm learning something new every day.
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So that's why we definitely recommend, you know, if you're trying to get good audio or video production, you got to bring in an expert.
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Yeah, justin, all right, you said that's why businesses exist.
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This was the question I've been most excited to ask you about here on the air is because when I look at the people who are doing this especially having lived in LA, like I mentioned I think to myself they have these tangible skills that so few people have.
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Why are they not all starting their businesses?
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And, justin, you are one of the ones who has done that.
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You've realized that you have these skills, so you took it upon yourself to actually start your business.
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What did that transition look like?
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What was the catalyst or that spark that made you say you know what?
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I'm not just going to do this for a career, I'm going to start a business.
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Yeah, so it's funny because I've kind of always had this entrepreneur spirit which goes all the way back to playing in bands.
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I mentioned doing music and you know I would start these bands.
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And a band, in a sense, is like starting a business, because you're getting this group of people to work together and you have a common goal to.
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I mean, eventually you hopefully make money, but you know, obviously you want to get your name established as branding.
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So I realized recently that really that was my exposure to entrepreneurship was trying to do these bands and then running my own doing freelance production, to do these bands and then running my own, um, doing freelance production.
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But the transition in my current business I was working it and audio visual, um, a couple different companies and, uh, basically you know standard nine to five job and I started this company as just kind of a side gig, as people say, and I would just do projects here and there because friends would approach me you know whether it's like a friend from a certain church that needs a new sound system or it's just like somebody doing a podcast and they, hey, I need help with this.
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And so I naturally just started the, the the side business, and the side business quickly started getting traction and getting busier and busier.
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So the employer I had at the time was really cool.
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They liked my work.
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I still work with them they're actually a customer now and they supported me during the transition and let me kind of go part-time at first until things got busy and then I was able to full-time into the business.
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Yeah, I love that transition story.
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I think that this is the most organic path to having a full-time business is by starting as a side hustle.
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Too many people think that we need to get it right from day one, but, justin, it's a story I hear a lot as well as your past employer is now a client of yours, and it makes sense because you do good work.
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Talk to me about some of those differentiators, because you just dropped in real time, so effortlessly, a bunch of examples of real life needs.
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Churches all have these needs.
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People who start podcasts all have these needs.
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Anyone who's creating video content has these needs.
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I'm thinking about the commercials that we see on TVs for local law offices.
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There's so many different needs there.
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When you enter the marketplace and when you talk to these types of people, how is it that you explain it to them?
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Because I would imagine you have so many skills in your mind that you want to tell them all the things, but of course, you have to speak to them on their level.
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What do those?
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conversations look like yeah, it usually starts with like a phone call, which often, if it's something that we're going to pursue, you know, if I was like, oh yeah, we're a good fit for this customer, then I'd usually do a site visit because there's so much information together before I can, like give my advice on what I think they should do.
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And so the conversation starts with like, okay, what's your goal?
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You know, what are you guys trying to do?
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It's like, oh well, we have this multipurpose room and we just to put up a couple of TVs and be able to do a wireless mic.
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It's like, okay, well, so then my brain started thinking, okay, how big is this room?
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How many people are going to be in it?
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How loud do they need the music?
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Do they need party volume, do they just need background music?
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And so it starts with, basically me interviewing the customer and trying to really dial down what they need and what they want, and, you know, not always the same things.
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So figure out what they need, figure out what they want and then figure out, kind of, what their budget expectations are.
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And can we make all those things happen?
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Yeah, I love that.
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I would imagine the mass adoption of Amazon has made many people think that they are an expert when it comes to audio and visual equipment.
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You talk about budget and of course now we can hop on Amazon and see all the best sellers and all the deals and have them at our doorstep the very next day.
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Talk to us about the actual equipment and the budget that goes into it, because a lot of people probably don't realize how to correctly set themselves up for success.
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I'd love to hear some of your insights there.
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Right, yeah.
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A lot of people.
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They may know some things and they know that.
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You know we need some speakers and we need a microphone, but they won't know the details that really make those work good in their space.
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Like they also need to have, you know, properly powered speakers for, however loud they need it and they really probably don't know how loud they need it how loud they need it.
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They also need to take into account you know acoustics, about what the room looks like.
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Then they need to do processing, what we call a like digital signal processing.
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You'll hear terms thrown around like tuning a room, which is actually using processing, to use equalization to make a room correct itself.
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Basically with the equipment, because there's different frequencies that build up through reflections and by applying processing we can actually correct some of those things and make it sound better.
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And so a lot of times people will have an idea of what they want, but they don't know those specifics.
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And that's where where we come in and make suggestions and kind of fill in the holes where they're missing.
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Yeah, I love that approach.
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Talk to me about some of the cool applications, because hearing you talk about these things, I can't help but think back to this one electrician that I knew when I lived in the Boston area and I used to host business workshops at his showroom.
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So he's a local electrician in Watertown, massachusetts, a small town, and what he realized was I have all these cool things in my showroom as far as smart home automation equipment and TVs and sound systems, but how the heck am I going to get people to come in?
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And so, justin, what he did is he created an audio visual setup and offered it to local business owners, like myself when I had a marketing agency there, and he said you can host your events here for free.
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All you have to do is supply food, invite the people here and my showroom can be your place.
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It can be an event, a venue that you can use.
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And he had all that equipment, justin, so we could literally just plug and play.
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And it was great for his business because we brought people in, and people, when they were there, would say holy cow, I didn't know you had all these TVs.
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I didn't know you had all these TVs.
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I didn't know you had this audio setup.
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I didn't know that you had this smart home stuff.
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That was a cool application to me of how you can unlock possibilities by taking audio visual seriously.
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Now, of course, he's an electrician so he's probably equally geeky as you are about all of those things, but it's just one example.
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Give us some cool practical things that you've seen that have opened up possibilities for businesses and local venues.
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So a big one that a lot of people don't really know about, even though it's become really popular, is what we call networked control, and so this is highly customizable.
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And what you do like an example so recently I did a kind of a dining room at a place that has multiple rooms, and so you have a processor somewhere, it's basically a computer, and then in these dining rooms what the end user, the customer, ends up seeing is just this touchscreen that just has little faders, little volume knobs for exactly what they want.
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So you can just have one that'll say microphone, one that'll say music, one that'll say master volume, and then you could have one that says turn on the lights and one that dims the lights and the ones that turns on TVs, and it becomes that simple for them.
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And then I can even put like a picture in the background on this touchscreen.
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And so there's all this stuff going on in the backend, but the customer just gets this simple touchscreen that's customized to their needs.
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And that's where we come in, because we take this really complex system and then bring it down to a super simple user interface that has exactly what they need.
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And so that's where kind of the industry is going is networked controlled AV systems.
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Yeah, it sounds really cool and to a lot of us, we'll think that sounds way above my head.
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And, justin, back to your point.
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That's exactly why people like you exist and businesses like yours exist, so I'm super grateful for the type of work that you do.
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Talk to me about events, especially.
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I think that, in a world where everyone's transitioning to AI and everyone thinks that everything can be technology based, it's so fascinating to me seeing someone with your skills that you do so much of your work in real life, and I think that that's becoming increasingly more important in this new year, here in 2025, that people are going to come together.
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We're never going to lose that human element, and I think it's fascinating the work that you do as far as not only virtual conferencing, but in person setting up rooms, setting up these events.
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What are those considerations there?
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Because, truth be told, justin, we've all been to events where the audio visual is off and that affects the experience that we have at those, so I know that you are thinking of all of those things in advance.
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Talk to me about how you think of and create that positive experience for people who attend events.
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Yeah, that's so important because I've been to those events too and really that comes down to experience.
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And before I started this company I did live sound, contracted live sound, for several years and a lot of times working with local churches and places that we would go, we would go to different buildings and set up, and by doing that, by going to all these different venues and then having to set up there and do sound in these different rooms, that all had different challenges, it gave me, you know, a certain set of like problem solving skills and, um, and from there I'm able to kind of apply that when I go into a new space uh, whether it's it's a temporary setup or a permanent setup, but you take those, those problem solving skills and it's like okay, so in this room we have a lot of reflections, so we might need to actually set up some acoustic panels.
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And you know so, some uh, acoustic panels you can put on the wall to cut down the reflections.
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Or in this room, this room's really big so they need more low end because there's just not enough power or the speakers are only hitting half of the audience, and so with the experience you kind of get those troubleshooting skills, those problem solving skills and you can just dial things in for the specific customer and their needs.
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Yeah, I love that.
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It must be actually fun hearing you talk about the work that you do.
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Justin, I'm thinking you just walk in and start solving a puzzle and first things first, you have to figure out all the different pieces.
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You're introducing so many variables into this conversation today, and it's really cool because these are all real life things that we have to think about for our unique setups, and so I want to switch gears a little bit, because we're obviously talking commercial side, but I know that you also do work on the residential side and when it comes to home automations, that's something I'm super geeky about, justin.
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I think it's so cool All the possibilities that are out there for us.
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In recent years and I would imagine this year we're only going to see that accelerate.
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Talk to us about home automation and what types of clients you're taking on there and what types of solutions you're introducing for them.
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Yeah, home automation is really exciting and I think that industry is only going to grow and become kind of more affordable and more available to kind of to the entire market.
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Where up to this point it's been more more kind of high end residential that where up to this point it's been more more kind of high-end residential that really go for the home automation, the full setup.
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But now you're seeing a lot of these, um, kind of just smart apps that you can do like you.
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Like I have an app for some plugs I have in my house and I was able to just program those to our our christmas lights, you know, and then you can set a timer on it and so that's example.
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That's like the most simple example of home automation.
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On the other end, where it's going to is more of these program systems, like I was talking about controlled network, controlled AV systems, and we're doing those in houses now too, and at that point when a customer hires me to do that for them, there's actually programming involved where we take all those kind of different devices.
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Like you might have one app for your thermostat, you have another app for your lighting dimmers, then you have another app for whatever your sprinklers or your pool.
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Everything has a smart version now, and so what we can do now, and where the industry is kind of gone, is that you can take all those different apps and then program them together into one central processor that works with those different companies, and then the customer ends up with just one control, like a touchscreen or an app on their phone where they can control all those different things, and it's really cool.
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I was just at Home Depot yesterday and I saw this refrigerator which had a huge touchscreen on the door and that was my first time seeing that.
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I was like, wow, that's probably where we're going, and from that touchscreen you can just hit a button and see like your energy use, you can see your thermostat and the temperature, you can see the weather outside, and that's what we're doing on these smaller tech screens.
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That was just my first time seeing it on a refrigerator door, which I thought was pretty cool.
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Yeah, I love that, Justin.
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It's cool to hear someone else who's equally fascinated by all these tech advancements as I am.
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Have you ever heard of that app?
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If this, Then that.
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I don't think so, but that's, you know, common programming language, because that's pretty much every like.
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That's like the basics of computer science is if this condition, then do this, and so I'm guessing it has something to do with that.
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Yeah, I've become a big fan of it because of what you talked about.
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You know, my lights have one setting and my door locks have another setting and my AC system has another setting and if this, then that integrates with all of them, so I can say, if I leave this geographic radius, then turn these lights off.
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You know, turn the AC off, do all of these cool things.
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It's cool to see the power that is being brought to the people.
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However, I want to ask you this question because, from a technical perspective, part of me wishes and I know it's very easy to say this in hindsight and probably all of us feel this way, justin I wish that I committed to an ecosystem when I was starting out buying all this smart home equipment.
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How important is it of committing to an ecosystem versus what I've since done via apps like if this, then that, figuring out how to just make them talk to each other, regardless of the ecosystem that they're all in?
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Yeah, so there's a few different options on the market that basically their goal is to kind of tie together all those different brands and these different vendors, their systems it's known like certain ones that work good with them.
00:20:03.324 --> 00:20:03.743
You know.
00:20:03.743 --> 00:20:11.598
And so, as you're planning, I guess what you should think about is how much convenience do you want?
00:20:11.598 --> 00:20:16.017
Do you mind having 12 different apps or do you want it all to work together?
00:20:16.017 --> 00:20:30.436
You know, because, like with me, I have a control system that does my lights, it does my home audio, it does my security cameras and I'm going to end up integrating some access control like locks.
00:20:31.005 --> 00:20:34.976
But then I have, like I'm thinking about swapping out my.
00:20:34.976 --> 00:20:39.950
I have an old analog sprinkler timer and I want to swap that out and I don't care if the new one.
00:20:39.950 --> 00:20:42.271
I'm going to get a smart one because I want to be able to program it on my phone.
00:20:42.271 --> 00:20:47.884
But it's like that I don't really care so much about integrating into the home automation.
00:20:47.884 --> 00:20:54.054
I mean, it's got its own automation in it where you could, it'll know the weather and if it rains and it'll delay it for a couple of days.
00:20:54.054 --> 00:20:58.412
But it's like I don't really need that in my centralized platform.
00:20:58.412 --> 00:21:02.887
And so I mean, the big question is what's your end goal?
00:21:02.887 --> 00:21:08.911
And then from there you can kind of decide do I need to standardize or can these things just be separate?
00:21:09.451 --> 00:21:34.433
Yeah, justin, I hope that listeners hearing us geek out about all of these possibilities here today take it upon themselves to look into this, because I will interject here Obviously you and I are talking on an entrepreneurial podcast is that these quality of life upgrades and improvements they not only make our lives easier so that we can focus on what matters, but I would argue this and I'm actually I'm going to kick it back your way because I want to hear your thoughts on this is that it changes the way that we think.
00:21:34.704 --> 00:21:46.931
I find that the more that I change my home automation setup, the more it challenges me to view my business through that lens and the more it challenges me to say, hey, operationally, when something happens, what should kick off?
00:21:46.931 --> 00:21:48.632
What are my backend systems?
00:21:48.632 --> 00:21:54.961
It's truly changed the way that not only I enjoy my life at home, but it's definitely changed the way that I see the world and see my work.
00:21:54.961 --> 00:22:16.108
Talk to me about that attitude, because I'm sure that for you, someone who's lived in this world for 20 plus years now, it has so deeply ingrained the way that you operate that it's leaked into not just the services you provide but the way you run your business the way that you help other businesses grow.
00:22:16.148 --> 00:22:17.071
Talk to me about that mindset behind all this.
00:22:17.071 --> 00:22:18.436
Yeah, when you mentioned that, two things come to mind like.
00:22:18.436 --> 00:22:23.230
The first one, like you said, is processes, and that's really what it is in a nutshell, that's home automation.
00:22:23.230 --> 00:22:46.986
You know that if this condition happens, then the reaction is this, and applying that to business is so important, especially as you scale, I think, because you know I can't be involved in every single step of everything and as a business scales, I should be less and less involved with the little details, and so the only way that things are going to stay on track and be consistent is with processes, like you said.
00:22:46.986 --> 00:22:50.750
So you know coming up with your systems and having them documented.
00:22:51.412 --> 00:23:15.053
And yeah, I think being involved in technology has definitely kind of ingrained that into my mind, and just studying IT and computer science is that I approach things that might not be technical, that it might be like a more of a, you know, just person to person relationship type thing, but but I can approach those things on more of a technical level.
00:23:15.053 --> 00:23:30.696
I mean, sometimes that may be good or bad, but but yeah, yeah, I definitely have that ingrained in me to to problem solve on a technical level and kind of get down to the root cause and effect of things and then fix that the root cause and effect of things and then fix that.
00:23:30.696 --> 00:23:49.150
The other thing I was thinking about with home automation and how it kind of helps is freeing up your time, Because when you're running a business your time is so valuable and being able to automate processes and automate things it frees up your time to focus on other things which could grow the business.
00:23:50.065 --> 00:23:51.150
Yeah, it's so true.
00:23:51.285 --> 00:24:01.838
I love hearing the way that your mind thinks, because I've already said it a few times here in today's episode but I so respect and admire the way that your industry operates, because there's so many moving parts.
00:24:01.884 --> 00:24:13.499
Of course, we all have moving parts in our businesses, but when it comes to your industry, I've just been in enough event spaces and on enough production spaces to see that if one thing goes wrong, it throws literally everything off.
00:24:13.499 --> 00:24:22.240
And it's such a detailed approach which hearing your entrepreneurial mind in action makes me want to switch gears a little bit, justin, because I do want to tap more into that entrepreneurial mind.
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:34.641
Even before you and I got together today, on your website, I read through your testimonials, I read through what people say about working with you and it just sounds to me like you're not only good at what you do, which is important, but you're really great at servicing clients.
00:24:34.641 --> 00:24:44.490
Talk to us with that entrepreneurial hat on on some of those things that you've picked up along the way to create those great experiences, not just in the end result, but the process of working with people.
00:25:15.493 --> 00:26:10.680
Yeah, that's one of those things that's thrown around in the IT industry that just don't, and it's actually this cliche in, uh, the music industry that that sound people, that sound engineers in general live sound engineers are difficult to work with, and it's like this, this ongoing kind of joke, like, oh, the sound guy is going to be a jerk, and so I've frequently, um, well, the funny thing is, is it, I've come in across that a lot, like I used to tour and we would run into sound guys and a lot of times it was like they're just mr grumpy pants, and so I've uh often gotten compliments that hey, you know, yeah, you're really great at sound, but the thing is like we just like working with you, like you're friendly and easy to work with, and so, yeah, the combination of having the technical skills and what we call soft skills and those two together, I think has really attributed to my success and is probably one of the big challenges of a lot of people in tech.
00:26:11.425 --> 00:26:12.448
Yeah, and a lot of that.
00:26:12.448 --> 00:26:27.259
When you talk about soft skills I'll go far beyond just sound and production stuff is that in business it's hard to manage those client relationships because we're managing expectations, we're setting expectations, we're managing deadlines, we're managing deliverables, we're obviously communicating.
00:26:27.259 --> 00:26:34.037
All of these things get wrapped up into soft skills, but all of these are equally important when it comes to growing any business.
00:26:34.037 --> 00:26:37.029
So, justin, what do your projects look like?
00:26:37.029 --> 00:26:46.875
I would imagine that there are things that you do, because you're working in a highly technical field, that you know a heck of a lot more than your clients do about the stuff that you're doing to them, but at the same time, you have to share with them.
00:26:46.875 --> 00:26:56.753
Hey, here's the progress, here's the timeline, here's what happens when things go wrong.
00:26:56.795 --> 00:26:58.821
How do you build all of those important steps and considerations into your project roadmaps?
00:26:58.842 --> 00:26:59.704
Yeah, well, you hit one of them.
00:26:59.785 --> 00:27:04.385
It's just communication, just a constant communication and expectations with the customer.
00:27:04.405 --> 00:27:23.775
And so from the beginning I try to be really open about the whole process, like what the process is going to be like from design to, you know, procurement of equipment, to actual physical installation, to programming and commissioning and then finally user training and customer handoff.
00:27:23.904 --> 00:27:46.852
And so a big part of it is just communicating all that up front, giving the expectations, because a lot of people have no idea, you know they might contact and think that a huge, you know big fancy conference room with, like a you know LED panel or whatever could be up in like a week and it may take two months just to get the equipment ordered or manufactured.
00:27:46.852 --> 00:28:09.846
And so, yeah, a big part of it is just being upfront right away and setting those expectations, like you said, and then also communicating, communicating the milestones throughout the process, like hey, just sending those little emails or calling with a quick update, like hey, so I just put in the order on my end, we're expecting the equipment, you know, in three to four weeks.
00:28:09.846 --> 00:28:21.048
I'll contact you with any updates and I think just sharing those little details along the way and communicating those milestones are super important to keep the customer involved and informed.
00:28:21.569 --> 00:28:32.170
Yeah, I really appreciate those insights and it's no surprise to me, having the chance to chat with you here today on the air, why you have such a good reputation in your area and in the work that you do and the company that you've built.
00:28:32.170 --> 00:28:47.434
I wanna put you on the spot here to ask you this question because it's clear to me how much you think like an executive and a proud business owner, and earlier in our conversation you talked about the time when you viewed yourself as a freelancer and you were just picking up that freelance work.
00:28:47.434 --> 00:28:56.032
Justin, it seems to me like that mindset has changed and transformed and grown as you've grown your business, that you don't think like a freelancer anymore.
00:28:56.032 --> 00:28:58.692
It's so clear to me that you are an amazing business owner.
00:28:58.692 --> 00:29:04.253
What's that difference For listeners who are in that phase of their mindset, growth and personal development?
00:29:04.253 --> 00:29:07.912
What's the difference between the freelancer mindset and the business owner mindset?
00:29:09.826 --> 00:29:12.451
And yeah, yeah, mindset, I think, is everything.
00:29:12.451 --> 00:29:22.786
And yeah, for many years I was just a freelancer, like a solo guy, where it was just I just tried to pick up work where I could, you know, do the production work and that was it.
00:29:22.786 --> 00:30:00.365
But now I think of it as you know, it's a company, it's beyond me, as you know, it's a company, it's beyond me, it's not just me, and it's something that that I'm growing, that I want other people involved with, to grow with me, and so it's kind of that mindset of shifting from solo to team, you know, and so, and even when if it's just you, you can still shift that mindset, because if you can't see it as you know, a larger organization and as a, as a team business, if you can't see it like that, then it'll really never go there.
00:30:00.365 --> 00:30:10.252
And so, yeah, I think it's all mindset and vision, uh, vision casting and then going after that and believing that it can happen.
00:30:15.565 --> 00:30:16.047
Yeah, so well said, justin.
00:30:16.047 --> 00:30:22.673
I'll tell you what we've been really excited to have you here on the show, because a lot of people, when they look at your business and your industry, they might be thinking, yeah, audiovisual, it's important in so many different ways.
